1915 '08 question
 

this one has O.R.J.3 marked on the front of the grip. Any ideas what this signifies. Thanks
Regards Stew

I'll make a guess here--
O = Ostasiatiches (East Asian)
R = Infantry Regiment
J = beats me
3 = Weapon number three
What has me confused with this one is the J.
There is a marking with it - O.J. which means the same thing as above except the J stands for Jaeger Battalion.

All German troops in East Asia had been defeated, captured or were being chased about the Indian Ocean in 1914. Very unlikely that 1915 dated pistols were being newly issued in East Asia or for that matter, Africa.

How about:

Officier Reitschule Jaegers No 3

Basically, it's virtually impossible to give a good description without knowing:

-The age of the gun
-The placement, type and shape of the lettering/numbering
-The shape of the gun (police/army/etc..)

So adding this info to a decoding request (preferably a photographed one) will help.

Tacfoley, not my idea, the info came from Jeff Noll's book 'The Imperial German Regimental Marking' I failed to mention that in my post. I wondered about that asian connection also. There is no entry for the info provided by Vlimmeren so I can't comment on that.

Hi Herb,tac,George and GvV.
thanks for your help. The '08 has come up in a New Zealand auction catalogue ,so no pix are available.
However it is described as having a 4" barrel and its serial# is 8711.It is described as 95% original finish.
I am a newby to Lugers and this forum so thankyou for your help and comments.
Regards Stew

Stew, Welcome to the Lugerforum. You need to look up one of our long time members and collectors, Murray Willis... He is also from New Zealand... and might be able to educate you on the ins and outs of collecting these masterpieces in your country...

Search each forum for "Murray" and you may come across his contact information, or at the very least can send him a private message...

TAC,

Could the Imperial German Army soldiers in question here have possibly been security personnel or attache's in foreign embassies? Just a guess.

Tac, not the Imperial Army but rather Navy and Colonial troops in Tsingtao on the coast of China, taken by the Japs, and a smattering of Pacific islands that were used primarily as coaling posts. The New Zealanders and Australians took some of the latter.

A little info, Von Epp was assigned to the 4th East Asian Infantry Regiment in 1900, so at least one regiment existed for some purpose. This was in China.
http://216.239 ]http://216.239.37.104/search?q=cache:QJQJV5_fb0cJ:www.thirdreichforum.com/viewtopic.php%3Ft%3D7915%26start%3D0+%22east+asian+infantry+regiment%22& hl=en&ie=UTF-8]http://216.239[/UR L] .37.104/search?q=cache:QJQJV5_fb0cJ:www.thirdreichforum.com/viewtopic.php%3Ft%3D7915%26start%3D0+%22east+asian+infantry+regiment%22& hl=en&ie=UTF-8
also see- http://motlc.wiesenthal.com/text/x07/xm0701.html

Now that I have established that the East Asian Infantry Regiment(s) actually existed and the grip marking might stand for that it still does not explain the 'J'. In Nolls book he indicates that J.R. stands for Infantry Regiment and Jager Regiment and that the J. stands for Jager-battalion
those are not compatable with this stamping.

Hi,

The only China-marking I've seen is depicted in Gortz's 'German Small Arms Markings' and depicts a Navy with 'Gouv. Kieau 246". German-kept China territory was administered by the Navy. And since they were kicked out of china in November, 1914 I doubt that a 1915 P08 would have Eastern Asian markings.

Other colonial lugers shows Sch.D.O.A. (thought to represent Deutsches Ost Afrika) and L.P. (landespolizei). Problem is that both do not appear to be in line with the O.R.J. inscription shown here. Another problem is that there are no official sources about German colonial markings.

The book also mentions a number of 'O' possibilities, and they are 'Oberkommand' or 'Offizier-' (for officer's schools).

The representation of 'J' for Jaeger is generally accepted, 'R' can depict Regiment, Reserve, Reitschule or depending on the date a district.

The exact dimensions and form of the lettering would help a lot, as mentioned earlier.

All, Very interesting discussion on a very unusual marking. I am going to have to think about this a bit but the first thing that comes to my mind is that the catalog this pistol is listed in may have misread/misprinted the marking. More than a couple of times I have spent time researching a marking only to find out is was reported incorrectly. Other questions are:

1) Is the "R" a Roman font or a Script? Script would indicate "Reserve" such as Ostasiatiches Reserve-Jaeger-Bataillon, Waffe Nr. 3

2) Is the "3" a small number indicating a weapon number or is it nearly the height of the letters?

I do not believe it is a Offizier-Reitschulen. These schools were at Paderborn, Soltau, Dresden, Sprottau and Beeskow. If there were a school in a town beginning with a "J" it would be a different story.

Likewise I agree with George A. that the Deutsche Ostasiatiches activity was nearly dead in 1915.

Is there any way to confirm this marking? w/r Jeff Noll

Hi All,
It has occurred to me also that the catalogue may have had a typo .I will not be able to verify this until 3 April which is the day of the auction.Thanks for your help.
Regards Stew