How to tell someone the bad news..
 

All,

My method is to ask politely for permission to examine the piece. Once I get my mag lite on it, if necessary, I then ask the owner what they know about the piece. Based on what I gauge the owner's intelligence and emotional involvement to be, I point out discrepancies as I observe them, explaining in each case what the correct condition should look like and then inviting them to compare.

When I sense I am getting resistance, I thank them politely and leave. I am simply trying to inform, not convert "true believers". As someone remarked, "A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still".

Fortunately, most of the people encountered with Navy pistols have sufficient maturity to accept the information with grace, if not severe disappointment.

Tom A.

Tom's advice and help on my bogus Navy Luger purchases has been just the way I prefer it, blunt and factual.

Saved me a lot of money.

Luke

In this vein, I encountered a Luger at the Des Moines gunshow this weekend. This Luger was described as all matching serial numbers, an officer's model, and an asking price of $1000.

Examination showed it to be an obvious mismatch (part numbers did not agree.) with no chamber date. Non-original grips and non-original barrel. It had the Erfurt logo on the front toggle. Finish was a very mediocre nickle plate job. Plating was too thick, looked like a rough polishing job under it. I didn't bother to look at the bore. Assuming it had a decent bore I would place it's value at about $325. But then maybe it belonged to Rommel when he was a lieutenant...

Felt like telling the guy I had half a dozen Lugers, all better than the one displayed and he could have his pick for $750. But I decided discretion was in order and slowly walked away.

On a more positive note, I picked up a NIB Interarms with a consectutive serial number to one I already have. Now with two Lugers with consectutive serial numbers I have a matched pair. All I need now is a black eye mask and some leotards.

Well, I have the problem of being irritated at news like that. But for goodness sakes, like Luke said, I'd rather hear it and base my true feelings against what is true. I always think in the back of my mind, this guy just wants to buy it for cheap. <img src="graemlins/cussing.gif" border="0" alt="[grrrrrrr]" />

But, later I think about it and usually know that she was right. Ooops, I mean, not my wife, but in dealing with gun show guys.


So the short of it, is that I might not WANT to hear bad news, but I would rather hear it than not.

Tom, quit tempting me with your "slashed" prices... [img]wink.gif[/img] Divorce is not something I desire right now. [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Tom, I have a general question for you. I am sure you know way more than most of us as far as spotting fakes, reblues, redone Lugers, etc. Out of say 100 Lugers you look out at gunshows how many would you say are "buyable" based on being a richteous original gun in good condition? I think the answer is important to beginning Luger collectors/buyers to understand that most Lugers have some "baggage" after all they are old and have been through so many hands. Again, this enforces the adage that knowledge of markings, history, and "sales pitchs themes" are of paramount importance. Thanks! <img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" />

Hi Ted,

Interesting question as unless one hits the really big shows (KC, Tulsa, Vegas, OKC) there just aren't that many Lugers that show up. At the bigger, "High roller" (For lack of a better term)shows, I'd say 85% plus are buyable as the crowd tends to be very sophisticated and word of bad guns goes through the crowd like wildfire. The news about the bad navy guns at MAX was known by just about every Luger guy there and in the crowd within 15-30 minutes of show opening.

At the smaller shows, gun and hock shops I guess less than 65% are correct. Most have had very minor, but detectable, "Enhancements" such as touch-up with cold blue (Always smell the gun! Your eyes may lie but not your nose)markings refreshed or added, grips recheckered, etc.

The real p*sser is when some bubba who obviously did not just get off the MENSA bus tries to pimp you with a re-do that wouldn't fool Stevie Wonder. When that happens, I just walk away.

Tom A

Tom,
I would like to get your (as well as anyone else's) opinion on essential items one should take to a gun show, to aid the prospective buyer in determining if a Luger has been "boosted" (i.e. small "Mag-Lite", magnifying glass, etc.)?

My Luger might as well have been bought in the dark! I knew absolutely nothing about them, I only knew I liked them!

I don't want to make that "Shot in the dark" again!

All comments appreciated!
Brandon...

I've heard that before (the smelling of a gun to see if it has been "cold blued"). I'm lost, what does it smell like (and the differences please)?

What keys you off that what you are looking at is a "reblue"??

Thanks

Cold blueing has a distinctive smell. Hard to explain, but kinda vinegary smelling. Fresh cold blue jobs are easy to detect by sniffing, The older the re-blue, the less strong the smell is.

Generally, cold blue is easy to spot if you know what to look for. Seeing many examples of it are the best way to learn.

John
Seneca Arms Co

Rub the suspected area of cold blue with your thuumb to warm the metal slightly. The odor of the copper sulfate becomes much more noticeable and has almost an acid smell. On a rust blued or salt blued pistol there should be no odor at all when rubbed. If you smell something other than gun oil, immediately be suspicious.