Two-date DWM
 

Hi!
Here are some pictures of my latest Luger. I have heard about two-date Erfurt, but this one is a DWM. Are there many two date DWM out there? This one got "1917" and "1920" on top and what appears to be all matching #.
I'm new at collecting Lugers, so I'm learning a lot from you guys. Any comments on it?

http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/luger2_copy6.jpg
http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/luger3_copy3.jpg
http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/luger5_copy3.jpg
http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/luger1_copy6.jpg

On a search on the forum I just found pictures on a simular luger (topic="New Double Date of interest")

Worgan the difference is that yours is a Weimar property mark. After WWI the new Weimar Republic ordered that all arms be marked with the 1920 property mark. The onter one that I think you are talking about was a old upper that was used after the stamped date and then marked with the current year of production! <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Morgan, Your's is a Weimar reworked 1917 Artillery Luger. The barrel most likely replaced as per the Treaty of Versailles. Which mandated that no military pistol could have a barrel length exceeding 100mm. Therefore they replaced the barrels on artillery lugers with ,primarily 4" barrels. The 1920 was used as a military identification or property mark. To prevent the pistol from being stolen and turned in for bounty, during the civilian disarming phase. The cut on the front of the chamber is for an 8" barreled artillery rear sight.
You might want to remove the grips, and take good clear photos of them. Inside and out. They could be original Black Widow grips. If so, are very valuable. And not original to this pistol. Frank or one of the Reichs collectors can verify this for you. I won't even attempt to.

Ron

Morgan, I have seen as many DWM, and maybe more 1920/1918 and other dates of DWM's compared to Erfurts. Here is one that I have :D ;
http://forums.lugerforum.com/cgi-bin...c;f=2;t=000981

Ed

Thanks!
Interesting that the gun has been reworked due to the Treaty of Versailles, it kinda makes it a small peace of history..
I guess thats why Luger are that interesting, they all carry a history of some sort;)

Anyway, I will take some photos of the grips when I get my camera working again, lost my USB cable:( I find it a bit strange if they are not original, but never know..

Very nice Luger Edward! Can you asume the value of a double date Erfurt? It's on my list that's going for Santa this year;)

btw. are artillery barrels and rear sights hard to find?

Hi Morgan,

Even with a Weimar reworked Luger, some of the small parts such as the trigger, take-down lever, thumb safety, ejector, and magazine release should be strawed colored. Cannot be sure from your photos, but they appear to be blued on your pistol.

If you do a "search" on the Forum, you will see good info. postings on how to do strawing at home...in case your parts are blued and you want them restored back to straw colors.

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

The answer to your question is YES Morgan... Artillery barrels and sights are difficult to find for sale...

There are reproductions available but the cost is also high.

Hi,

Here is the link to pictures of my 1916/1920 DWM.

http://lmd-militaria.com/page157.html

Regards, Leon

Nice Luger Leon! Hope mine will look like that one day. Mine is probably reblued on strawed colored parts, I might try to fix that myself during the winter.

Too bad artillery barrels and sights are difficult to find.. But i quess that's not so strange. Thanks again for information from you guys.
(btw. hope my avatar image is right size now;)

I took some photos with my digital camera on my phone.. the quality is not so good, but you guys have some good eyes when it comes to Lugers;)

So.. are these from a "back widow"? The number writen inside by hand is the same as the serial#. Thanks:)

http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/luger_grep.jpg
http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/luger_grep3.jpg
http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/luger_grep4.jpg
http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/luger_grep5.jpg

Morgan, Even with the quality of the photographs, these appear to be genuine "black widow" variety grips, but the reproduction clones are getting better and better every year...

The area that concerns me is the dark surface fault on the top inside of the right grip. I have not seen any genuine black bakelite grips with a mold fault... does this area look like post production damage to you? or original to the grips?

:)
I think they are post production damage of some sort.. But I'm not sure. The surface is rough at the fault. Perhaps from heat..?

The person that sold it to me did not mention the black grips, so i keept my mouth shut about them;)

But I actualy like wood grips much better! Feels better in the hand + looks nice instead of plastic fantastic grips

Morgan, thanks, nice to see what you have! :)

Ed

Well You learn something new every day. I also have a 1917/1920 and now from the pics and this discussion I also know that it was an artillary model. Now for MY question - is this variant worth more or less than if it had been a "std" P08 with the 4" bbl being original?

Jim, in my opinion, all being equal, original and condition, a Nazi era luger is worth the most, then a Imperial then a Weimar that may have been modified...

Was yours converted to police sear safety? Does it have any unit markings on it?

Ed

Just a note regarding my artillery Weimar, some time after it's 1917 production, it has gone trough these changes;
short barrel, "black widow" grips, unoriginal magazine and something that looks as if it has been soaked in black paint of some kind! (not reblued and looks terrible).
So i quess mine has no big collection value and is just a step on my way to a "real" artillery luger <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

Mine has 2 sets of police unit markings. One is X'd out. No safety conversion.

Jim, can you start a new thread, give the x'd out and non-x'd out markings, and hopefully provide pictures? Top, bottom, both sides?

Ed

Done....posted on Unit Markings Board