Re: Grip pics.
 

Thanks for the pictures, Doug. And thanks for investigating this on behalf of the members here. One has to wonder why it wouldn't be just as easy to program the machine correctly as to program it for a poor fit.

Re: Grip pics.
 

I would imagine that since there is a bit of diff in frames, they compromise. I got grips for my Luger and the grips had to be adjusted, but look so much better than the old ones I had.


Ed

Re: Grip pics. NC Programming
 

Doug,

In as much as I was one of the first 12 NASA NC Programmers.

I can assure you that the reason is most likely "A sloppy One cut fits all" program.

This would cover expansion and contraction due to moisture content, variations in Luger frame dimensions and such.

With a little extra cut off to make sure.

If one finds a fit here they have a "dimensionally minimum frame in the grip area", and therefor that their good fortune.

ViggoG

Re: Grip pics. NC Programming
 

Viggo,

While I understand your comment, Nill seems to have found the formula. I have only seen 3 sets of the Nill grips, but all fit as well as the originals. True: I had to trim up to 1mm off the bottoms of them to make them fit, but the critical areas around the top fit perfectly, without modification, in all three sets.

Nill specializes in grips, so I suspect that they simply take more care in their design.

Luke

Re: Grip pics. NC Programming & Quality"
 

Luke,

That is exactly what I was referring to.

Quality Products are out there, and so are the fast buck artist.

My Compliments to "NILL", They seem to have a quality product, With proper allowances for final fitting.

My comments were to condem the sloppy work that some try to pass of as state of the art, just by using the magic word "NC Machined".

The NC Accuracy capability is Beyond Challenge, Only the care of the Programmer, Tool Operator and Stock Quality give Problems.

ViggoG

Re: Grip pics. NC Programming & Quality"
 

My complaint with Nill is that they are using heavly grained walnut with dark, almost black, vertical stripes.

When I look at most authentic, original Luger grips they seem to be fairly uniformly colored. And, Nill prices aren't very attractive. Sure seems there is an opportunity for a quality manufacturer to make a profit by selling accurate grips made of a variety of woods (as G.T. does mag bottoms), and at a reasonable price.

Re: Grip pics. NC Programming & Quality"
 

Luke, you are right about the Nills and the color and figuring. I think GT told me one time that a lot of the nice walnut on Luger grips came from trees in Europe that ARENT being replentished. I would like to see someone try to find some nice light beech or ash or even maple (must be a hard wood) and fabricate some out of them. Just think how many hundreds of thousands the Germans made and now even the nicer ones have some wood and checkering problems. I have a set of Nills that is really not very attractive. I wont even show them to Don Leverty. I bought them to put on his gun and when I saw them i said "nope" these are NOT going on that purty ARTY! I would dearly love to see Hugh make some border grips to match the awesome photos he sent us of the early type (Bill Stanley knows the ones I am talking about), A golden color wood, WOW! Thor

Re: Grip pics. Wood Source)
 

Folks,

I hate to bring bad news, but to the best of my memory, the wood of which you speak is Technically known as â??European Highland Black Forrest Walnutâ?�, and NO NEW Cutting has been allowed for the last Fifty or more years. The trees require over 100 years to mature to grade two quality and another 100 years to reach grade one.

Hitler and his Cronies Raped the Best quality trees for their own uses and now it is unlawful to even pick up deadwood without a special forestry permit, With no harvesting permits in the mill for many future years.

If anyone knows this to be incorrect please tell me so!

I hate to be right about this.

ViggoG

Re: Grip pics. Wood Source)
 

Hi Viggo! Unfortunatly I believe you are correct! From the contacts both in the US and in Europe that have answered my questions on this subject, they all say the same thing...European walnut of that quality, has been long gone....I would imagine that WW1 used up most all of it....and WW2 probably used all that was left in Germany, and all that could be found in co-belligerent and conquered countries....I have had people say they could supply this high quality walnut, but none has become available despite my best effort's to purchase some!! Can you imagine how many grip panels could be made from one large tree! As for substitute woods, Current European Beech is very dense and of high quality, and can be purchased in quantity....ash, and hickory although hard, are tough to stain, and don't have a very pleasing look when finished, large grain like oak...(small parts look bad,looks great as a baseball bat!)...maple is worse...it is the densest wood I have ever worked with and is great for setting your fixtures and tooling, but it is unappealling when finished.....can't hardly make it take stain! The best dense walnut that is available now, is exibition grade French walnut, it is great to work with, but has so much figure, that it doesn't look like the Luger grip panels or mag. bottoms we are used to! It is pretty expensive also....A real shock was mahogany! I found some that seemed a dead ringer for the red/orange color that is so popular with Luger fans....every thing was going great ...until I applied the finish..they actually seemed to glow!! They were so bright that they just looked strange! Nope, Mahogany wasn't the ticket! Cherry wood has some potential, I will experiment on this next summer, and I will continue the search, but it has not been to rewarding up to this point! till...later...G.T.

Grab on ole table leg
 

I guess you can look for some old European tables, you could get lots of grips from four table legs...


ed

Re: DON'T Grab on ole table leg
 

The only trouble is

1" x 1.5' B F Walnut table legs are too expensive to use.

Antique wood you know.

ViggoG

Re: How about a K98 Stock
 

Bet one of those could make few grips

Re: Grip pics. Wood Source)
 

G.T.


I use American cherry heartwood a lot; it is one of my favorites. The heartwood turns a light golden brown when coated with clear, flat urethane. The sapwood is about as hard, but it is almost as white as maple. Cherry is about as hard as rock maple and as easy to burn with routers and power saws. The heartwood can have a lot of large grain like oak but select pieces are almost clear.


The real problem here is getting someone to make grips that FIT. I contacted Nill about using other wood types and received a negative response.


Luke

K98...some problems!
 

Hi Thor! You are correct on the quality of wood in K98, or K98K stocks, and I have used them successfully several times for mag. bottoms, the problem with the stocks when used for grips is the amount and location of screws and other fixtures/holes that are part of the stocks make up...The Germans didn't miss to many places....so it is a crap shoot at best! But the jury is still out on feasibility...till...later....G.T.

Re: Grip pics. Wood Source)
 

Hi Luke! I am always open to trying new types of wood and wood sources, Cherry is getting lots of support! The problem with present day luger grip manufactures is they attack and sell to,the larger inexperienced market, people who either don't know about, don't care, or are unable to decern the difference between a sub-quality and high quality part....I have battled this in the mag. bottom business for years!! Other manufactures probably sell ten to twenty, to my one...but my customers to a person, are knowledgeable, well versed, Luger people! The grip thing will come about in time...patients boys! till...later....G.T.

Re: DON'T Grab on ole table leg
 

Not if "she" is out of town for the weekend and you never liked that ugly table


Actually I have seen the darn'dest things at yard sales, tables and chairs.


Even picked up a piece of oak that was very old, plan on using it one day. Now, if I could remember where I put it...


ed

To GT, about valnut.
 

Would it be correct to use Swedish m96 Mauser stocks?

Is that wood correct?

If it is, I belive it would be farily easy to get you swedish stocks from sporterisized guns to work from.


Regards HÃ?Â¥kan



http://www.vapensmedjan.com

Re: To GT, about valnut.
 

Hi Haken! I have tried the M96 stocks, and althougth very nice color, they are very soft....I don't know what type of wood they are made of, but I don't think it to be walnut?? Thanks for the suggestion! till...later...G.T.