Interesting possible test-1900?
 

Let me first say that I'm just trying to learn about these early lugers and not trying to "flame" anyone or their gun. The following is on Gunbroker and based on my reading here and on Jan's site, it is probably an "out-of-range" 1900 AE test-luger.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...?Item=97936762

It has been restored - looks real nice - but what does that do to the value? I asked this question in another topic about the restoration "run-of-the-mill" lugers and the consensus was that it dropped the value by half and made them a nice shooter. Does the same go for this gun and why or why not? Would you have such a gun in your collection or would you save your money for a worn original? Thank you for your time.

John

John, I have two lugers that fall within the "accepted" range (6100-7100), but new thinking is that unless they fall within the Bannerman range, they are "suspect" and could or could not be Test Lugers.


The "nice shooter" comment is not exactly as I see it. The more 'rare" an item is, the less it is affected by being "restored"; that said, I still believe in the half theory, that a restored gun will sell for half of what a non-restored but still reasonablly nice gun. i.e. in my opinion, my Fat barrel that I sold for under $3600 should have been worth around $8000 in 80% shape if not reblued...


Ed

My general feeling.... you don't have to be rich to buy a $8,000 original, but you have to be rich to buy a $4,000 restored. Paradoxical.

Ed's pretty much on the mark. I've sold two expertly restored Lugers for just about half what they would have been worth in original condition.

Ron

So what's an unrestored test-luger worth nowadays? The cheapest one that I could find on the internet was $6000. I can't believe the restored one on Gunbroker is worth $3000! Alvin's comment hits home along with "what other nice unrestored lugers could I buy for $3000?" Man, that's a problem I'd like to have.

John

it is smarter to save up, research, buy books, then buy a nice example of whatever interests you.


Jan Stills new Central powers has the latest info on Test Lugers. I think the 6100-7100 numbering system will stay with us ofr a long time, but the bannerman numbers are the ones that will eventually be worth more.

A test in "okay" shape in the 6100-7100 range will be $2500 +, while one in the bannerman range I would guess would be another $1000 and up depending on condition, with $4500-$6000 not surprising me in the least.


ed

The persistence of the 6100-7100 approximation bugs me. From the Bannerman numbers the series goes at least to 7147.

--Dwight

Dwight and I are in the same camp regarding the myth of the 6100-1700 range. There is no doubt in my mind that the serial numbers of the US Test Trial Lugers did not run contiguously from 6100-7100. The Luger on Gunbroker with the number 7176 is only 28 away from the highest Bannerman number and, in my opinion, has a finite possibility of being a test piece. I am reluctant to toss out a properly marked Luger between 7100 and 7199. For a gun numbered beyond that point I think the probability of being in the trials diminishes considerably.

It's out of the Bannerman range but still a possible test-luger? So, where does that leave it in terms of collectability? Is it still a collectable luger of lesser value because it has been restored or a restored luger that used to be potentially collectable? Wow, try saying that five times really fast.

Thanks!

John

Why didn't Uncle Sam dump all 1,000 guns to Bannerman for sale to recover more tax payer's $$ ..... one theory saying "The 230 pistols whose serial numbers are not shown [in Bannerman] were probably rendered useless in various tests. It is quite possible however that a small number of these unrecorded specimens came into private hands."

http://www.nps.gov/spar/historycultu...r%20ranges.doc

If this is correct, the chance of a gun falling out of Bannerman and being a TE is not high.... unless it's broken. Or, it's not broken and it's in good shape, then its originality becomes a big question mark, because it's supposed to be "useless".

I would be a little reluctant to draw too many conclusions from an article that starts out with the title "Lugar" Pistol Serial Number Ranges! ;) Note that there were 780 pistols in the Bannerman purchase, not 770 as the article states.

Also remember that 50 test pieces in good condition were swapped for the 50 Cartridge Counters. These 50 were turned over to a US distributor for disposition. They weren't included in the Bannerman purchase and there is no record of their serial numbers. But they are legitimate test pieces and they are in the mix.

Therefore, we have 220 not in the Bannerman purchase minus 50 swapped out, leaving us with 170 guns that were either lost, damaged beyond use, stolen or given away.

Ron -- Thanks a lot for the analysis. I heard that you have an article in Jan's book (?)..... I still miss a few books, would like to order one.

John -- Good luck in searching! More and more, I feel reading books and searching is more fun than holding a gun in hands. Of course, finally still need a few samples.