Mauser Parabellum: Internal Numbering
 

Hello friends,
I would like to analyze better in this topic a point already raised in: http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11952
with new and interesting discovers.
Just recently we discover that some rear toggles of the Mauser Parabellum have the last three digits of the serial number engraved.
I checked my Bulgarian commemorative (1975) and my LP08 commemorative (1986) and both shown the rear toggle engraved. Therefore Mauser was used to apply this numbering during the entire production.
Actually not all the Parabellum shown this internal numbering.

Now the new discover: I have dismounted my LP08 commemorative and my P08 to check the rear toggle and I have discovered that several parts have the last two digits engraved.

The model with more sub items engraved is the Commemorative LP08 then the P08 and then the Bulgarian commemorative.

The LP08 has the following parts engraved with the last two digits of the serial number:
Rear Toggle, Side Plate, BreechBlock, Safety Lever (numbered 47).

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/pic11.jpg
http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/pic8.jpg
http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/pic12.jpg
http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/pic15.jpg


The P08 has the following parts engraved (numbered 58)
Rear Toggle, Side Plate, BreechBlock

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/pic14.jpg
http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/pic1.jpg
http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/pic9_copy3.jpg


The Bulgarian has only the rear toggle engraved.

What should be interesting to find out is why it was necessary. In fact, I was personally convinced that with the technique of production used in 1970 it was not necessary to identify sub items of the pistol. I was assuming that all parts were interchangeable.

An hypothesis is that the pistols were assembled and tested internally before bluing, therefore it was necessary to keep trace of the most important parts of the pistol.

I would like to know if your Mauser Parabellum have similar inside numbering and also if you have some hypothesis concerning this point.

Thank you.
Ciao
Mauro



:typing:

I checked my Navy commemorative and it does not have the additional engraving.

Tom A

Hello,
Thank you Tom for the info. Actually not all the Mauser Parabellum show this internal numbering - why? :confused: -.

I have moved hee some more info that are also available in the aforementioned topic to help the discussion.
Gerben pointed out that his 1972-and-a-half variation has the rear toggle link engraved (see pic):

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload...ving_copy1.jpg


In addition Dave (Ponyman) wrote that his 29/70 has the rear toggle engraved too.

Please Gerben and Dave can you check if there are some other parts engraved in your pistols.

Thank you for the info.

Ciao
Mauro
:typing:

Hi Mauro,

Pulled the pistol apart and found no other parts with engraved parts of the serial number, just the rear toggle as shown before.

Some unfinished pistols from Mauser production were sold in their original assembly boxes, as shown in the image below. The best explanation I can come up with is that several small parts were worked on outside the assembly boxes and were marked to ensure they would be mated back with the right gun after the work was done on them. Why this meant that some parts were numbered or marked and others weren't is beyond me. It seems to prove that Mauser Parabellum production wasn't exactly a full time job and that projects were halted, stashed, worked on, stashed again, etc... over a large time span.

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/setzkasten.jpg

Mauro, allow me to confirm that my 9mm 29/70 has internal hand engraving ONLY on the rear toggle: 3 digits. This is the first time I recall mention of engraving on the TD lever - just checked, mine has NOT.

Ciao,
Dave

Herb and Dave,
Thank you for the reply.
I think this absolutely interesting. Actually the pistols with more engraved parts belong to the Bignami contract for Italy. The Mauser Italian Importer asked for a special contract in the 1986-90 era with LP08 and P08 in 7,65 mm. The quality of these pistols is greater than the normal production. This can justify that the parts were checked and numbered with more care than the normal production.
I will continue to investigate this area.
Thanks
Mauro
:typing:

Hi Tom,
Today I had the opportunity to see the Navy commemorative number 73. Actually this pistol has the number 073 internally engraved in the rear toggle link.
The same collector has an early production (1972) in 9mm. This pistol has the last three digits of the serial number engraved in the BreechBlock.

In addition this guy ordered a pistol to Mauser in 9mm with, in addition, a barrel with receiver in 7.65mm.
What is interesting is that this set barrel and related receiver is numbered E13.005352. The second part of the serial number follows the normal pattern. The first part no. Do you have any idea about the meaning of this E13. I assume that only the complete guns was numbered with 10. or 11.
Any idea?

The current owner is a very important Belgian shooter, he has an unbelivable set of customized sights and toggle for shooting purposes.
A pleasure for the eyes!

I really hope to be able to buy some items. I cross my fingers!!

Ciao
Mauro

Hi Mauro,

The most obvious explanation for the E would be 'Ersatz' or spare/replacement. Probably because it's illegal to have two barrels/receivers numbered to one gun.

Hi Gerben,
I guess you are right. When you wrote the reply I had just added some more info.
This guy has really interesting items.
Ciao
Mauro

Hello,
Today I took some pictures of the Navy commemorative number 073von250 to show the internal numbering. As you can see the rear toggle link internally is engraved with two numbers: the 073 (the number of the pistol) and also with 43. I donâ??t know the meaning of the last number.
The fact that two pistols belonging to the same commemoratives series are one internally engraved and the other not is not clear at all.
Ciao
Mauro

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/navycom1.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/navycomm.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/navycom3_copy1.jpg

I took a close look at mine yesterday and the toggle link has the last three numbers engraved on the bottom.

Steve Richards