1900 AE - Opinions/Help...
 

Had a seller of a 1900 AE (non-Test piece) send me some detailed photos...

Just wondering if folks here agree with some "red flags" that I think I see...

http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/1900ae1.jpg

http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/1900ae2.jpg

http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/1900ae3.jpg

I tend to conclude the following, but being a novice of less than 2 years, would appreciate other opinions and comments :

1. Lack of a "polished" area is troublesome.
2. The lack of depth and letter definition in the "Germany" stamping leads me to believe some sanding occured.
3. Lack of any "halo" around the barrel stampings.
4. Uniform blueing in all the letter/number stampings.

My conclusion is/was this was a fairly good refinish, but one nevertherless...one that is old enough to show some honest patina, though...

In the defence of the retail seller of this piece, it is not being advertised as "original finish"...rather the sales ad is "silent" either way...

Appreciate your time and help...

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Pete, I agree with you. The safety 'well' is just too smooth, some maching marks should be seen here. I think it is refinished, nicely though.

I nice restoration good.

Albert

I also think it's been refinished but, as has been said, a very professional job judging from what I can see. I am not surprised at the lack of machine marks in the safety area as early Lugers were finished to the very highest of standards. My father often remarked about the finish of early Lugers he owned back in the 1920's and how all external machine marks had been polished out.

I agree that it looks like a nice refinish job. <img border="0" alt="[oops]" title="" src="graemlins/oops.gif" />

The early Lugers received some of the highest quality finishes of any mass produced item, to the point that the machine marks occasionally were virtually undetectable, much like the example shown. However, Pete pretty much zeroed in on the most significant indicator of refinishing with the statement "Lack of a "polished" area is troublesomeâ?�. On early Lugers, the polished safety area was milled deep enough that there is a discernable edge to the polished area and visible mill marks. Simply re-bluing will leave traces of this milling. On the example shown, the entire area has been fine polished thereby completely removing the safety milling. A restorer or forger will re-cut the polished area. To his/her credit, the individual that expertly refinished this Luger did not. It is a fine looking piece, but it is refinished.

Now, for another topic that has been nagging at me that this Luger brings up. The lack of halo around the serial number. I canâ??t explain it, but I have observed that the early Lugers that have numbers stamped on the curved part of the barrel flange tend to not show a halo. You can see that the metal is â??upsetâ?� around the individual numbers, but the blue usually does not lighten or â??haloâ?�. However on Lugers where the numbers are stamped further out on the barrel on the â??straightâ?� part, the halo shows up. I would appreciate it if other early Luger owners could check to see if they observe the same lack of halo in this area.

Good observation, Ron. I checked my 1900 AE, as well a my 1906 Commercial. Both have the serials on the curved part of the barrel (We docs call it the proximal part) and both are WITHOUT the halos.

OK Doc, then I amend what I said to "the number halo appears on the distal part of the barrel". :) Thanks for the input on your Luger markings.

Thanks all for your inputs and help...

Here is the link to this gun, if folks want to see more photos...

http://www.pugsguns.com/displayItem.do?id=463

The fellows were very helpful with sending photos of areas I asked for...and I sensed they appreciated the feedback I gave them about the restoration work...

I appreciate gun retailers that are starting to provide good resolution photos and are willling to send more in the course of responding to a customer's inquiries...

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

One more thing I see wrong. Look close at the extractor. Looks like a late Swiss style with heavier front half. http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/03110e.jpg

Doug, I agree that the extractor is a Swiss type replacement. I also think that the serial numbers on the barrel are also suspect. Perhaps this was also replaced and the numbers engraved rather than stamped. TH

Doug and Tom,

Great catch...on the extractor...

I believe the Swiss replacement, reinforced ones are usually seen "in the blue" so seeing it "strawed" also adds to the refinish confirmations...

Appreciate everyone's time helping me out with this pistol...!

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Well...this one sold...

http://www.pugsguns.com/displayItem.do?id=463

Hope it did not go "out the door" as original...

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Hi,

Maybe my eyes are playing tricks on me, but I'd swear I see traces of some sort of 'safety' marking on the second photo?

Hi Gerben,

Your comment urged me to take a much closer look, but even under magnification, and high contrast and negative images I can't see evidence of a weld repair and resurfacing to remove the "gesichert". The surface of this area looks original to me as far as metal preparation goes... I can't speak to whether or not the metal has been refinished.

http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/nogesichert.jpg

Hello John & Gerben,

I think on a 1900 AE, the "polished" area of the safety would be visible when the lever is in its upward position...since this is a grip safety model...it should not have "Gesichert"...at all...in either the upper or lower position.

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Pete, I think Gerben's concern was that this was not a genuine 1900 AE...

Thanks, John S.,

Silly of me to miss the obvious in Gerben's intent...

I will wear my "bone head" hat for the remainder of the day... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="eek.gif" />

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Pete,
You can borrow my hat. It is badly worn from frequent use.

Hi,

I'm still not sure, it looks like something has been written on the metal surface, that left a slight trace on the blueing. It's very superficial.

Oh well, maybe I'm just starting to 'see things' :)