Black Grips on eBay
 

The black grips shown appear to be the soft plastic repros, but the bidding is up to $155.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...item=731824381

Do these seem authentic to anyone else?

Luke

I am not into black plastic as it is not Weimar period, but it does not look good to me.

Luke,

The BW grips looked like they could be authentic from the "poor" rear side photo shown. I was bidding for awhile, but decided to stop.

I have a nicer set of BW grips that I was hoping to save by using these BW grips when shooting from time to time...but I stopped bidding when the amount got above "chump change"...

Regards,

Pete... <img src="graemlins/yltype.gif" border="0" alt="[typing]" />

Just looking at the pics, I can't see anything wrong with them.

These grips are somewhat worn and a little dirty, but as far as I'm concerned they are legit!!

I would not touch those grips with a 10 foot pole as they say in my neck of the woods. <img src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" border="0" alt="[bigbye]" />

But why?

Do you have a feeling or is there something about them that shouts out to you?

I once knew a ten foot Pole. His name was Stan Kowalski and he played basketball.

I have looked at these several time, it looks to me that some has tried to touch up the checkering? I could be way off here, but just not a good feeling.

Here's another pair that have gone over $ 233.00 [img]eek.gif[/img] and the auction is still on-going :

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...item=733726538

Guess that "marketing ploy" seems to be working...

Regards,

Pete... <img src="graemlins/yltype.gif" border="0" alt="[typing]" />

Pete, the only difference between the two pair, is the second one is a bunch better quality. I have a rear view of that one and I believe it is legit also. Maybe that's one of the reasons why the so called Black Widow is selling for a higher price than the wood grip model. That, along with the fxo black plastic bottom magazine. The best I can tell the differential should be $200 to $250 based the going price of the grips and Black Bottom Magazines. It seems the actual differential is much higher. ?????? Don't know why [img]smile.gif[/img]

Ed,
I see nothing in the description's that indicate either pair of the grips are original! For the prices being bid I would sure want to know if I was getting an original pair. I guess in my old age I am getting awful leary of some of the stuff being sold!


<img src="graemlins/wave.gif" border="0" alt="[byebye]" /> http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/MauserForum01.JPG

AAAAHHHH, esteemed Toggletop. Excellent catch!

I too am leery everytime that it does not state 3 day return, original or if it states RARE!


You are probably right and we'll watch for the fun.... <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

Sir Edward,
I am not very esteemed, I am just a luger nut. I do get fascinated by watching some of the bidding frenzies on some of the stuff being sold. Just think, without these computers how uninformed we would be!
<img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" />

Here is a nice inside view of authentic BW grips, that I think John Sabato had posted on the Forum, a few months back; thought it might help to compare with the grips now on auction :

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/BWGripsInside.jpg

Regards,

Pete... <img src="graemlins/yltype.gif" border="0" alt="[typing]" />

Pete, I base my decisions on 1) the published data on the "originals" and 2) the grips I have that I know are "originals". It is conceiveable that there are good fakes out there, but those are goig to be the breaks!! Good old Waffenamt USA lives!!

To Frank, and the rest of you guys...

Comments edited after closer examination:

IMHO I pronounce these grips in the first auction as authentic... They do have the threaded holes upon close examination... but well used. I don't know if someone has tried to sharpen the checkering or not, but I doubt it. Bakelite is not like modern day plastics and has a high fiber content. when it is scraped with a sharp tool like a checkering chase tool, it tends to get fuzzy. I think these grips have been cleaned really harshly, but are certainly serviceable... I don't think I would have paid this much for them though... Maybe half of that.

Here is a closeup of the inside photo of th grips in the first auction that I have enlarged and sharpened the focus on... You can see the threaded holes and the tool marks that are similar to the grips on the old photo of mine that Pete posted.

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/au...ps11122002.jpg


The second auction grips look very nice... but without seeing the back I can't offer an opinion on their authenticity... I have requested a closeup of the inside of these grips from the seller.

Ok Guys, here is the way I see it, I think we are giving the reproduced grips way to much credit... I have yet to see a grip made from bakolite (Sp.?) (thermo setting) that was not original... and, I have yet to see a grip made from thermo forming plastic that was! the real trick here, is to become familier with the different properties that are unique to each plastic, and gain a knowledge base that lets you make on the spot decisions... heres a real good first step! Take an original Black Widow grip...and try to make a fingernail mark on the back side! Your going to try for a long time... as they are hard as hell! This is the same stuff they made old phone receivers out of, and it is really tough stuff!
Lets hear from others how they tell...we all have our little pet tells... just like poker, that's the way I see it! Best to all...till...later...G.T. <img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" /> <img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" />

G.T.,

You are correct about the repros not being made from a thermosetting plastic. The repors I have seen were made from injection molded plastic. One set was very good and I thought it may have been been made from ABS as it was tough, BUT, the fingernail trick you discussed showed that it was no a thermoset phenolic.

The grips on auction also appear to be original, but worn.

Marvin

Hey! Welcome back Marvin! Hope you can find the time to participate more frequently...

The auction for the 1st. set of grips that Luke brought our attention to just closed at ~ $ 198.00. Pretty pricey for a worn pair...

p.s. I have found there is a weight/density difference between real BW grips and repro's; with the real BW grips being much heavier and more dense...

Regards,

Pete... <img src="graemlins/yltype.gif" border="0" alt="[typing]" />

Here are some close-up scans of the inside of the grip panels on my '41 byf "Black Widow" luger :

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/petesbwgrips.jpg

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/petesbwgrips001.jpg

Regards,

Pete... <img src="graemlins/yltype.gif" border="0" alt="[typing]" />

Excellent images Pete... thanks.

Some really bad BW "repros"...

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/BWrepros1.jpg

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/BWrepros2.jpg

Regards,

Pete... <img src="graemlins/yltype.gif" border="0" alt="[typing]" />

"Really bad" doesn't begin to describe those atrocities. Only your previous posting of really nice legitimate BW grips saves you from being soundly chastised and sent to bed without your supper for subjecting our eyes to such offensive matter. <img src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" border="0" alt="[bigbye]" />

Well, It looks as if the mint BW grips on ebay went for a record price... in the high $400.00's very nearly $500.00! The last 14 bids were between just two bidders... it seems as if the bidders had auction fever, as everyone else fell out at around $250.00.... which I thought was a pretty realistic price for the set... If the $500.00 mark is indeed a realistic price for the grips...then I think you will see a reverse trend for the next few years... that is, the walnut grips will go back on, and the upgrade BW grips will go on sale!! Best to all! till....later...G.T. <img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" />

Ron,

Fortunately, I own the former and not the latter...

The bad thing about those really "bad" grips, is that they are on sale with a pistol on one of the auction sites and the wording I recall is "all original"...

Maybe the seller's meaning of "original" is in the phrase "...that's what grips the gun had on when I originally bought it from someone else..."

Regards,

Pete... <img src="graemlins/yltype.gif" border="0" alt="[typing]" />

Mmmmmmmmmmmmm, well now lets see. One Luger grip set of Bakelite = $500. One reasonable Luger Shooter Complete = $500?? Is there something wrong here??? Hard to say what happens in the heat of an auction <img src="graemlins/c.gif" border="0" alt="[ouch]" />

By the way, the really bad repros that are depicted in the photograph in this thread are original grips. They were installed as replacements by the Russians and are common among the "dip blued" imports of the mid-90s. They make great shooting grips as they have excellent surface gripping with the hand but the checkering looks like it was cut by a very drunk Russian. They appear in black and, occasionally, brown. I have not seen any other colors but they were not made as reproductions but rather as upgrades or replacements to make servicable pistols.

IMHO, I find that the closing auction prices for the grips in question were OUTRAGEOUS and I feel sorry for whoever found it necessary to pay that amount of money... It must be a Luger collecting refugee who doesn't belong to the forum... because I think if the buyer did, they should know better... [img]biggrin.gif[/img]

Hello LP-08,

I am partial to the VOPO grips, if one is looking to place some "repro's" on a luger for shooting.

These pop up from time-to-time on E-bay and can usually be fetched for $ 20-30...

I have picked up a nice brown pair and a greenish pair recently; I understand there are black and even reddish VOPO's...

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/VopoGrips.jpg

Regards,

Pete... <img src="graemlins/yltype.gif" border="0" alt="[typing]" />