So This Is A Bump Fire Device~
 

From An Old Friend~ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvLt8-Wf7r0

Currently legal to own, but I'm guessing they will be shutting this product down soon.

I can't believe ATF didn't see a problem!!

Another Model~https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_SWefYWKw0

I wonder how long this modification has been around. This video is over 4 years old!! WAKE-UP!!!!

There is a crank/cam device that attaches to the semi-automatic trigger guard and allows 'Gatling gun' style shooting - this device has been around for decades.

This was posted by 'spacecoast' on our sister forum with hands only!!!!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_SWefYWKw0

Maybe i dont know much, but such a device/mod should be illegal!

Eric, Thanks for posting those videos.

What should be illegal is murdering people.

Ah! Wait. That is already illegal.

To quote Lady Thatcher: "Now is not the time to go all wobbly in the knees, George".
The problem is that you are now advocating dramatically changing the definition of a "machine gun" and getting it dangerously close to sucking in semi-autos. Multiple shots fired with one pull of the trigger has been the standard, probably going back to the GCA of 1934. Let liberals change that and you collectors of semi-auto pistols may not like the results.
Agreed that this should not have happened, but not willing to jump on the bandwagon and hastily support bad legislation.
This is the time for vigilance, not emotion.
Actually, in my own sick mind, I'm glad that he used the bump fire because I think a good rifleman could have done more lethal damage with a semi auto with nearly endless capacity and well aimed fire than he could to by spraying the crowd. Once the crowd thinned I'm betting his average went down dramatically.
Just my $.02.
dju

There is no way to prevent a sick mind! Oklahoma, a mere U-Haul and fertilizer, 168 dead 800 casualties, all without a gun!

I am thinking this case was more than a sick mind. The use of guns was deliberate. He was a pilot and owned at least one airplane, he could have caused even more damage had he used it. His attack was not only on the victims he slaughtered. It was a hard blow on the 2nd amendment.

He was a man on a mission. Others are giving continuity to his dirty work.

PS. If this post is considered out of line feel free to delete it.

We wecome your own comments! That America!!!! The man was obsessive paranoid highly intelligent. He waited till the end of the third day. An addictive gambler and sent his girlfriend $100k knowing it would be seized! I think he did it because of his ego. He wanted to be the greatest mass killer of all time. He followed Country Music and shot near the end of the concert when target we all facing away! He did everything for impact. As a gambler I know he must have been a guest there and maybe the same or close to same room. Measured trajectory and it was a calm evening for windage! A smart psychopath!

Why would it be? It doesn't meet the legal definition of a machine gun nor a conversion device. You get bump fire an AR15 (or just about any semiauto rifle for that matter) using the same pulling technique with just a finger in the trigger guard. Likewise, a shoelace hooked to the charging handle of an AK and wrapped around the pistol grip does the same. Do we outlaw shoe laces?

They have to blame on the shooter and his modified rifle on something!!! Maybe blame it on his finger!

You can cradle any semi-auto under your arm, and with a bit of pull with your left hand and keeping your trigger finger straight, you can make them all go rock and roll.
I'm no defender or fan of bump stocks, but your see where this could go, don't you? I could make a stocked artillery Luger do it with a bit of practice.
Full autos are no fun to me any more. Don't even recall the last time I shot any of mine, I know it has been several years.
I'm afraid there is only one real solution...
dju

An interesting thread for me who is totally uninformed on bump firing.

David

Eric you're right, but in the meantime here, and I bet everywhere else in Europe, the anti-gun people and anti-gun organizations are beating the big drum against firearms! :grr:

... never mind tomorrow I'll go to the range again with mine... :rockon:

Now everyone in the world knows how!!

Now that's a rifle...
dju

It's only a semi-auto though.
Sometimes I like to to to the range with a long gun, so I alternate from a bolt action to this semi-auto.

I just read that the NRA is asking the BATF to review its position on the "bump stop" regulation. Apparently, they are conceding this point. We see what happens next on this issue.

The are drafting new legislation as we speak! Wait till you hear this!!!The Bumb was made legal by Obama for handicapped shooter! The ATF and BATF people are going to get their ass kick for allowing such a loophole so long!!! NRA is backing the restriction! Very Smart! http://www.businessinsider.com/nra-b...tement-2017-10

I'm sure CNN will come down hard on Obama and his admin.

Banning bump stocks will do little.

In fact, Congress could ban guns completely, but crazy people will continue to kill. And criminals will continue to have guns, while the law abiding citizen do not. This man had enough explosives to kill hundreds if he wanted.

I'm not liking always givin' and never gettin'. This will happen again, and you know it will, what are all of you willing to give up the next time around?

Banning guns completely is highly unlikely. But there could be some weird measure coming out, such as limiting how many guns people could buy or sell each month... there is report saying Vegas shooter carried many guns with him to handle overheat issue in shooting... gun volume could be a target.

I am a director of a state level Gun Rights organization, and have been working for gun owner rights for close to a decade. This is a uniquely American issue, and I apologize to our International members.

- - - -

The media and politicians are dancing in the blood of the victims.

Bump stocks and action types and cosmetic features of modern sporting rifles are not the issue.

Psychopathic murderers are the issue.

I guess we are on the way to 22,001 infringements on the Second Amendment.

What the Las Vegas monster did was despicable.

I am a law abiding citizen. Why pass laws that unconstitutionally restrict my rights as a result of this?

We never are dealing with rational behavior when we collaborate with gun control advocates. They live by the mantra, "never let a crisis go to waste"... It's one of the Sol Alinsky "Rules for Radicals".

The other problem is that, in a free society, prohibition never works. It only causes more problems. Witness the track record with alcohol (where prohibition funded organized crime), drugs (where prohibition funds the international criminal drug cartels), sex (where entire industries now have replaced local issues) and other culturally harmful things.

If you live in a totalitarian environment you can even attempt to prohibit thought. Witness North Korea and Iran. In a free society, you just create business opportunities for criminals.

Maybe "bump stocks" and manual bump style operation need to be "controlled"... I know of one incident in all of our history that might lead you to consider this. I can also name a large number of other "risks" that are being ignored daily nationwide. The terrorists and criminal psychopathic murderers just haven't used them yet. I would like to maintain the right and the means to stop them.

Here's one example. Background checks do not work. They never have, and never will. What's different is that terrorists have learned to recruit and radicalize psychopaths with clean records. It happened in San Bernadino, Orlando and now in Las Vegas.

Unfortunately, the gun grabbing progressives are not interested in bump stocks, or bullet engraving, or cosmetic control of firearms. They are interested in complete elimination of law abiding citizen's rights to self defense with firearms. They are willing to play the game of death by 1,000 cuts, and lie regularly all along the way.

Just next month, Scientific American will be publishing an article on Gun Control which cites a number of already disproven "peer reviewed studies" including one I helped personally debunk - an opinion piece by a reporter at the New York Times with absolutely no basis in fact.

If we were dealing with normal social discourse, I might feel differently, but I can assure you - there is nothing rational or normal about those that want to control you.

The NRA needs to focus on nationwide concealed carry reciprocity and moving suppressors out of the NFA and into the GCA. I'm really unhappy about their political game.

Steve: I agree, this is just the start of "common-sense consessions".
The legislative branch is bending to the prevailing wind. And we have seen how much strength they exhibit.
It would be interesting if Trump refuses to go along. Even at the risk of over-ride. If there is anyone in Washington who is not afraid of a fight, it's him.
Maybe he'll trade Bump-Fires for Obamacare repeal?
dju

Congress CANNOT BAN FIREARMS all together because of our constitution. The founders didn't trust their old king of presidential sole power! However constitutional amendment can be enacted to further refine individual rights. Such as out law bumpers as they a 'modification' to here to now legal semis. Full auto approved auto firearms are legal with a permit! Bump we originally approved by Obama to allow physically handicapped shooters which sounds life a kiss ass more for a different NRA at the time. If he was shooting semis the death count would be less! Why didn't he apply for a class one auto because he was a paranoid **** that was afraid of something. Better Yes, He may wanted to be remembered as the greatest American mass killer~ The problem is there are probably thousands out there! You can still own full auto with proper permits! The police didn't have automatic wesome more copy cats out there! Eric, Esq

I noticed our old friend Hickok has been removed! Damage control!

The unfortunate truth is that since ATF is an executive agency, and Congress has delegated away states rights for firearms industry control based upon interstate commerce, Congress doesn't have to be consulted about this.

The other unfortunate thing in our system is that as long as courts tolerate constitutional infringement, they will successfully continue to infringe upon unpopular constitutionally recognized rights. There are now 22,000 infringements on the Second Amendment active in the United States. Each one passed by a city council, county board, state legislature or Congress, and each one either unchallenged or finally accepted by a court, appeals court or the Supreme Court.

I personally sat in a court room while a state Superior Court judge legislated against firearm rights from the bench. He basically said that the laws were complicated, he could not make sense of them and that he would rule the way he wanted to. We did not appeal because we were aware that the legislature would pass legislation in the area during the next session.

Rights are not granted by the constitution, they are recognized by it as emanating from a higher authority. Courts can infringe on that any time they wish to, as long as they are not overturned by higher courts.

For Congress to act, the constitution has to be amended. Don't put this one past the gun grabbers.

These knee jerk reactions "dancing in the blood of the victims" make me want to copyright the phrases "do something®", "for the children®" and "common sense®". If this sounds cynical, realize that I've been directly dealing with those that fight self defense rights for quite a while.

It sometime seems there are only 2 options, Totally ban all gun ownership or absolutely to restrictions what so ever! The NRA is willing to work toward a viable solution. Do the Democratic senator, congress realize they have 24 hour protection while we who put them there need a firearm to protect themselves and family! Police are often pushed to there limit! Fifteen years ago in our other house in the middle of the night, Debby and I woke up to a masked gunman standing at the foot of the bed pointing a gun at us both!. I had a 9mm Berretta but no where in reach. There were 2, one searched the house and the one with the gun pointed at us grabbed her handbag, The scariest moment when he fired 2 rounds in to the ceiling as they left! We never really got over it!! Have a gun close to your reach! You feel so helpless! You never forget the helplessness! Have your gun close! Eric & Debby~

I was talking hypothetically......it is unlikely. My point was killers will kill even if guns were banned. And criminals will always have guns anyway.

Its pretty silly to consider bump stocks a problem, the only danger they pose is poor muzzle control, and possibly sending a round over a backstop. Unless its mounted on a bipod, or tripod, automatic firearms are less effective due to being harder to control than semiautos anyway.

Personally I don't have any interest in bump stocks, and other than just for the occasional novelty of it, don't have any real interest in automatics either, nor can I afford to waste the money feeding them. Its truly saddening what happened, but I'm not consoled by the thought of more firearm related bans.

Hi Eric,

Are you sure? I've just checked and he's on You Tube.
I post the link of his last video put on the Net 4 hours ago. :rockon:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4sombIpZ6c

[QUOTE=Eugen;308878]Maybe i dont know much, but such a device/mod should be illegal!

Eric, Thanks for posting those videos.[/QUOTE

A very dangerous premise! What next, semi-autos? The Libs are always looking for way to get the "Fudds", (our average shotgun or rifle hunter) to turn on the Paramilitary crowd. This "give an inch" philosophy plays right into their hands. Every concession should be fought by tooth and nail.

There is a storm coming, and you are giving away your roof tiles!

Sergio. only his bump video I posted was deleted! I don't know about his others! There are still plenty posted!

"Bump" stock ban: only just the start!
 

Some of us had better wake up. The proposed language in one bill clearly specifies that any device increasing the rate of fire in a semi-auto would be included in such a ban. Lighter trigger parts and springs would surely fall into this provision because they would cause the weapon to be capable of firing more rounds in a specified time period.

The anti-gunners don't need to have the 2nd repealed- E.O.'s and ATF interpretations can continue to be used to weaken it & make it moot at some point.