How many of you shoot your numbers matching Old Models?
 

I've been wanting to take an Old Model to the range, and the best candidate would seem to be either a 1900 Commercial (#51xx) or a 1900 American Eagle (#97xx). Both guns are matching, and in decent but far from perfect shape (fading bluing on grip frame, etc.)

Before I take either of these shooting, is there anything I can do to try and ensure that it won't break? I'm assuming that the flat recoil spring is the most vulnerable piece. I would be shooting my own mild .30 cal handloads that work well in my Alphabet Commercial.

I shoot this M1900

http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthread.php?t=34747

an all-matching shooter purchased for that purpose. The pistol is a shooter because it very worn, significantly pitted in places has been refinished at least once and likely several times as the American Eagle is so worn it can barely be detected. So far I cannot report any part breakage. Round count is not high, less than 100 rounds over the past year. It accepts Fiocchi 93gr ammo just fine, in contrast to my 1906 AE which demands the longer and (I'm told) somewhat stronger Prvi Partizan ammo. Magazine is Mec Gar. The action has never failed to cycle correctly, it is tied with my 1936 all matching Mauser as my most reliable Luger. Bore is fair yet the pistol groups as well as any other pistol I shoot.

If I had a nicer 1900 I'd consider swapping out the small parts like extractor, firing pin, ejector, and left grip. I swap those parts on the relative rare occasions I shoot the all-matching '36.

Spacecoast,
I would not.
But would do what 4scale has done; in fact I've been on the search for just such a 1900 for a while.

So far, I've accumulated two spare leaf springs, but no extractor as yet, and the ejector is also a little different.

I don't have any 1900, numbers matching or otherwise. But if I had I guess I wouldn't shoot with it.

Mark,

I would not hesitate to shoot any of my early Lugers...but I bought them as shooters to be representatives of their variations. Each has an issue that knocks it out of the collectibles category.

1900 Commmercial--all matching, but light pitting over the entire gun, I have run fewer than a dozen mags thru this one, in consideration of its leaf recoil spring. But I would shoot it any time the urge may strike because its finish issues have reduced it to pretty near minimum for its value.

1906 AE old model--all matching, but possibly refinished, a tapped hole in its rear strap near the bottom, presumably to attach a homemade board stock, and a grip safety lever that was repaired in a very ugly way. This si my prettiest early example, so I will shoot it the least, and maybe get the hole and safety lever restored just for the heck of it when I can afford it, which expense I will consider my fee for shooting a gun with restored integrity (but not originality, of course).

1906 AE new model frame, had lots of finish wear and high corner rounding, plus a 3 7/8 bbl that had taken a beating externally--particularly the fornt sight and sight block. I bought a 6" barrel from Ed Tinker and had G.T. install it on the upper--but after I had it turned and milled to be 'pencil taper". This one is my main .30 shooter, due to the work done on it, and it has improved my IDPA match results, compared to the ATI GI 1911 knock-off I was using before. I will use it for one more match, which will use up the last of my Berdan primed rounds I got cheap from Samco--which is now out of business. (My 1917 DWM is 1920 Wiemar property stamped 9mm with a 4" Nazi-proofed bbl that took the place of its original artillery bbl during a depot re-work. For the sake of economics, I will use this in the IDPA matches.)

I also have a stainless 1900/2000 commemorative (100 years!), which one might call early style. Its condition will remain "rarely fired", mostly because its mag well is so sloppy that it doesn't work very dependably with any other than a couple of mags that fit it well enough to allow it to cycle. This one may actually be collectible--depending on whom you ask. I call the rest of them "interesting/collectible shooters", which is accurate, I guess, because I've collected them!

Oh, and they all seem to do OK with whatever I feed them. I've used the most readily available Fiocchi and S & B .30 Luger ammo with good results, some vintage Remington, and have some Winchester to try sometime, if I think I need to. The latter two ammos are still available, but not currently being made--but even if you find some, they will cost you over $1 per shot. I won mine at auctions, with low-ball bids, and none of the expensive stuff wound up costing any more than the run-of-the-mill stuff, even after B.P. and shipping. The Samco ammo was even more economical, but it was not easily re-loadable without converting the primer pockets. I used it at the matches because I wasn't so concerned about losing it.

I have two 1900 American Eagle Lugers that I have shot. One is a US Test pistol and the other is a much later five digit serial number variation. Neither of these pistols were in prime condition when I fired them. I only put two clips of surplus 7.65mm Finish ammo through each.

I do not feel safe firing the 1900 with the flat recoil spring. I have always felt that the flat recoil spring design was an inferior design, apparently George Luger felt the same.

I have since restored the five digit serial numbered luger and added a Ideal stock/holster to it. I had planned to restore the AE Test but have since decided not to mess with history.

I have a 1900AE and it is in 'fair' condition. All matching, mismatched magazine. It had a broken firing pin guide when I received it. It's 7.65 so it's not quite as volatile as 9mm, but I still would not shoot it. It has not been pampered by previous owners, and shows it.

But I didn't buy it as a shooter. I bought it to study. It is clearly more meticulously machined than a P08. I can appreciate fine machinery. When it was new it would have been a thing of beauty. :cheers:

Yes, I was surprised when I received my 1900! I remember commenting on the thread in which I introduced it to the forum that hand cycling its action felt like closing the door on a Rolls Royce!
p.s. I have an extra leaf recoil spring that I actually bought perhaps a couple of years before the pistol came along, so at least this anxiety could be eliminated if I chose to send some rounds downrange. It was priced low enough to be able to be passed on to someone else, or hold in reserve as a spare after I found a 1900.

Thanks for all the interesting replies, some things to think about.

I understand everything but the left grip...

So as to avoid the "$1million" chip!:cheers:

I have only fired one of my lugers once! It was my last and maybe the rarest, a 1914 DWM Artillery #1263. When I told George who sold me my gem, he admonished me as its a 10K luger which I should never chance it. He sent me a beautiful top shelf shooter with an Austrian barrel and a "HAENEL SCHMEISSER" magazine. PS Shooting my first, the DWM artillery was awesome!! Thank You My Hero!

I took my first and oldest Luger (like I bought it last April :D) to the range once. I had a blast, or so to speak! Its an all matching, except the mags, 1939 Mauser.

I put 40 rounds through it like it was a red headed step child. I shot it with complete abandon. I mean I only paid $1200 for it and so I wouldn't lose much if it blew up. OK, well maybe a finger or two. :D If I did blow it up, then I would be down to only one Luger, my all matching 1942 Mauser. I might have to change my name to "Four Finger Eugen". :D

Lastly, I plan to shoot my 1942...some day.

Eric,
You had better send the 1914 Art'y to me for safe keeping; you may get the urge to shoot it again!:D

I wish I could use the excuse I chose the wrong one!!

It is the one with "1914" on top.:D

Thank You!!!The other rarest is the 1920/1914 Imperial, Weimer, Nazi, Navy! All purchased from Uncle George Anderson!

Just to be safe,
send anything with a 1914 on top ! ;)

Jan has 2 in his Weimer Lugers both DWM

Yep. Everyone seems to think this chip is the result of removing the grip carelessly, but I had one break on a '36 Mauser at the range from recoil. Ten minutes on my hands and knees both located the chip and taught me a lesson. Pretty much every Luger I discharge has a replacement left grip now - except the M1900.

No need to worry about breaking off the chip on this pistol, a previous owner beat me to it.

Here's 1683 N, a 1916 DWM lP.08

Gentlemen (and Ladies, too),

I'm not sure this is a new idea, but it is certainly a way to break that chip off that isn't mentioned much.

Certainly, one should use caution in removing the left grip, being careful not to jack the bottom end up before the top has rotated away from the shank of the safety lever, but I think that loose grips are a major contributor to chipping that little chunk off. Here's what I'm thinking:

Loose grips will break during use, particularly if the looseness is caused by compression or wear of the raised portion on the fronts of their back sides, which runs most of the way from top to bottom. Consider that, when the gun is properly gripped firmly, the grip frame is propelled back in relation to the grips by the force of shooting. This effectively hammers that little ridge mentioned above. A slight looseness will grow, in response to this force, and when they are sufficiently loose, the proper close fit of an original grip will cause the wood behind the safety lever shank to come into play.

The data I can present, beyond this bit of reasoning, is limited to my own experience of breaking a newly-repaired chip to break right back off again. After reattaching the bit for the second time, I used a fine, round file to give it a little "breathing room", and also made sure the grip is a snug as possible. No problem since.

If suspiciously loose, the grip can be snugged--front-to-back--by laying in a bead of good, clear epoxy to fill and build up where there should be wood. O-rings behind the screws may help keep the bottom from drifting around, but will not address any front-to-back looseness effectively. What may seem tight initially will be thoroughly tested by actual shooting.

We are both owners of fine history!!

David your theory makes perfect sense. When I broke the chip via recoil, close inspection afterward indicated a slight bit of looseness in the left grip. Since then I use washers or build up any loose grip as needed with epoxy or CA to make sure the grips are tight.

Loose grips...

If you're too lazy to do epoxy (like I am), I've had some luck using a small amount of high temperature hot glue to build up the areas of the underside of the grip that might be chipped off. Then, if you press it into the frame before it completely cools, it will mold itself to the frame and you can get a nice tight fit.

A good idea! I do the same thing with the epoxy when it cures enough to not be runny, but still plastic, after wrapping the frame in a layer of Handi Wrap.

I agree, I've got several all matching DWM 1900s but personally would NEVER take any of them to the range.
Vintage collectible pistols in my opinion should NEVER be shot, I don't think even delegating them as "special occasion" guns, if shot, there is a chance of probability that something could break, and when that happens one no longer has a nice vintage Luger but just a box of Luger parts, it takes only one cartridge to destroy a gun but there is no way to predict which cartridge will be the last one.
My 2 cents.

Late to the party of very old thread.


My very first Luger was a beater twice-reblued Old Model AE which I shot occasionally with an Ideal shoulder stock--long since gone. I have a fake Old Model short-frame 9mm (I bought it for the example) which I will eventually shoot some. Everything else is safely ensafed.


--Dwight

I shoot my 1939 42 mauser all the time. It is all matching even the grips. Recently, a very small chip came off the left grip while firing (not the big million dollar chip). I found that little chip and glued it back on and the used 220 grit sandpaper wrapped on a dowel to relieve the grip notch.

I have an early 1937 Mauser (rust blued and strawed) with considerable holster "rash" pitting on the left side that I use as my shooter.

It's all matching and functions flawlessly.

With this "designated marksman", I don't feel the need to fire the other Lugers.

(BTW, I'm thinking of calling these old resurrected threads "Zombie Threads"...)

I mean, I did shoot my all matching DWM 1920 commercial. But I only did it once because I didn’t have a shooter and I was too enamored with my first, highly anticipated, Luger to not shoot it. That said, now that I have a shooter, I don’t have interest in shooting my good one anymore even though it’s .30 Luger cartrige is crisp and smooth to shoot. Only desire i have now to save enough money to get an arty/Navy shooter to rig out and have some real fun with.��

I have shoot my 1900 AE. I have not made a practice of shooting my 1900 Lugers because I am not comfortable with the flat spring/toggle locking system. However, I have frequently shot my later Lugers with the improved recoil spring system. Being basically lazy, my problem with shooting my collectible guns is the requirement to completely clean them. I now have shooters that do not get the same attention that the other Lugers receive.

Right now my oldest and most historic Luger is my 1900 AE.

http://forum.lugerforum.com/attachme...7&d=1311507248

Years ago I posted photos of it here: http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthread.php?t=26591 I still have it.

I have shot this 1900 on one occasion. A few magazine loads, and that's all.

On the other hand, I have one of the "Russian capture" or VOPO Lugers. This one stays in my range bag and gets shot whenever I feel like it. It functions flawlessly. You know what? In the hand it feels just like a $10k Luger. Do the math.

My big issue right now is whether I will shoot a Model 1902 Carbine I am negotiating. That's a tough decision. Any advice?

Curl

Very nice 1900.
I'd have to shoot the carbine, if it were mine.:evilgrin:

For what it's worth, in my opinion life is far too short. Lost a good friend last month who passed way to young. Enjoy shooting it without reservation.

that is true - lost a lot the last ten years

ADMIN - cape buff are not near as cuddly and perhaps a member or two were soft hearted, but they said your dead carcass was not soothing ;) ebt



I completely agree..I am not fond of trophy hunting or actually any kind of hunting. Or the pictures people are proud to show to any and all. A friend whipped out a photo of a black bear he had murdered..I wasn't very pleasant about it when I made him put it away and stop talking about it. No..I'm not a nut. I am aware of some hypocrisy. I eat meat. I know animals need to be harvested. I just prefer not to be forced to look at these kinds of photo's. On purpose or by accident. I like the bunny though!

Before I really understood the rules of preservation and "respect" for the 1911 Luger we did shoot it occasionally. More accurate than my Beretta 9mm because of the more comfortable grip. The recoil is also less "jumpy" than the Beretta.
After learning from this forum though, it has retired and is safely preserved for the future!

Right there with you. Paper doesn't suffer or bleed