Identifying
 

Hello,everyone thanks for letting me join ya'll forum.Here's what i got would appreciate your help identifying Luger 1918 barrel is 4" long,serial # 7107,.30cal,the mag # 820,& + mark,rifling is excellent.under the grips are mark on frame with a (0) & ought side a (n)

Hi, and welcome to the forum!

First, you have a 9m Luger, not one in .30 caliber.

The letter under the serial numeric digits on the frame and barrel is a suffix, and part of the serial number. I can't quite make it out, but it's probably a "f".

Odd to see the "GERMANY" stamp on one of these.

The lack of paint on the safety area, and the grainy looking finish make me think that it might have been refinished at some point. You would typically see halos around the serial number digits stamped into the barrel on an original finish gun.

It's marked in the military way, and may have been something unissued that was brought into the USA between the wars.

Any specific questions?

thanks for lnfo,when i purchase the gun i was told it was .30cal i put 50 rounds threw it.hope i didn't hurt it? i was told it was test Luger they had no paperwork.I gave $1000.what do you think the value is? and it is a f.

:eek: You shot 50 rnds of .30 Luger out of this pistol? I'm assuming you didn't hit anything you were aiming at....the barrel markings clearly show it as a 9mm Luger. I'm amazed it functioned....I bet you have some funny looking empty brass!

Yes it did the brass expand pretty bad that's why it didn't cycle.

As said it likely is still 9mm, it would have had to have been re-lined to .30 to be a .30 cal.; it started life as a 9mm.

Sounds like you confirmed it with funny brass and not cycling.

Value- what you paid + or - a bit. Depends on if it is refinished, matching and if it has any unusual markings or not.

You need to check the barrel rifling for damage before trying to shoot it again.

This guide will be helpful:

http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthre...ight=.30+luger

Thank you very much for the information big help.

I am surprised that it could fire, doesn't the 9mm seat into the chamber until the case can't go any further. So, I would expect a 30 luger (7.65mm) to pop to far into the chamber.

Further, whomever sold it to you, should have known better. Generally a 'germany' marked is 30 luger, but as said above I am sure it was sold on the market in the 20's by a retailer from Germany to the USA.

BTW, the 8,83 is the land to land measurement and unless it had been relined, would equal a 9mm. Which I had a 9mm that had been relined to 30 luger (note; 30 luger was easier to get in the 30's than 9mm in the USA)

Ed

Ed, I think the extractor will hold the cartridge firmly enough to allow the firing pin to strike the primer.....but I'm not gonna try it with any of mine! Failure to extract is no surprise either....the case mouth probably expands into the beginning of the rifling.

The expanded cartridge won't reach the rifling.
The no extract is due to the fact that there is little recoil, as the the .30 slug in a .357 bbl builds almost no pressure.

It can't recoil enough to extract or eject.

The bullet will do no damage to the rifling, even if it hits it.

I'd say no harm done, just clean the chamber and barrel well and proceed.

Thanks again for your time when I got the Luger I took it to my 1911 guy he told me why it wasn't cycling the ammo.back in the day was a lot stronge then today's ammo. So he put new springs in it weaker ones now I will be putting the original springs back and use a 9 mm.

Your "matching" mag should also have the f suffix below the serial number to be the original military issued mag. If not, your mag is most likely a Police replacement. Do your pistol have the mag &/or sear safety, which would also indicate use by the police. Tom

as the the .30 slug in a .357 bbl builds almost no pressure.

Probably not enough to recoil the barrel extension and eject, but I wouldnt say "almost no pressure"....the cartridge case is fully contained in the chamber, and I'd about guarantee you that .30 bullet would rattle down that bore and come out with enough velocity to kill someone.

I believe that the back side of the 9mm cartridge is the same size as the 30 cal.; therefore can't enter the chamber any farther than the 9mm. Am I correct?
Jack

This is sort of a head scratcher. Have we mentioned the #2 pencil test? We need to measure the bore to determine if the barrel has been sleeved down to .30.
dju

The mag has a f on it. you see in picture

So we still don't know if its a 30 Cal are a 9mm. Okay what do I need to do to find out what caliber is. What other information do y'all need on this Luger

Just look/measure the bore(at the muzzle). A 30 Luger projectile is .309 in. in diameter. A 9mm projectile is .355in. in diameter. There is also a sticky on this forum considering this very question.

The .30 Luger round chambers a bit more than fully--just a tad too far in for the extractor to grab it, though not far enough for a possible light strike by the f.p. I just tested by trying one.

"So we still don't know if its a 30 Cal are a 9mm. Okay what do I need to do to find out what caliber is. What other information do y'all need on this Luger "

Just look at the post I linked to earlier... It's clearly photographed.

A 9mm Luger cartridge will not fit all the way into a .30 Luger chamber, even though the rim is the same size. This is because the .30 Luger cartridge is a bottleneck cartridge with a bevel bottleneck case.

Also, unless it's been messed with, your barrel is marked as a 9mm Luger barrel.

The ammo specification was NOT stronger back in the day. That is a myth. You should not use higher power ammo like +P or surplus machine gun ammo in a Luger, particularly an older one like yours. Just standard velocity 9mm with ball (jacketed) FMJ bullets. The recoil spring should have 19 coils. Don't go messing with this until you properly determine the right ammo for this gun.

Thanks again I try to chamber a 9mm it would not chamber only half way so it's a .30 cal right?

This is lifted from another post: "see if a yellow pencil will drop into the barrel erasure first. If it will it's a 9MM."

Go get a yellow pencil and stick it into the barrel, and tell us what happens. Or if you have a good set of drill bits, carefully see which on will fit and also the first size that will not fit. And give us those sizes.

dju

A caution, not to use the business ends of the bits, but their shank ends, and to be very careful not to damage the bore by stirring things around in there.

Why not post some closeup sharp focus pictures of the muzzle? This would let us determine if the barrel has been relined, and what caliber it likely is. As mentioned earlire, your barrel is marked for a 9mm Luger chamber and bore, but it could have been relined.

If a 9mm Luger round would not chamber it could mean it's a .30 Luger chamber, or that something is stuck in there as a result of firing .30 Luger ammo in a 9mm chamber.

Since we're several days on, and you're having difficulty with this I'd recommend getting in touch with a competent gunsmith and having them look over your Luger.

Your local friends and M1911 expert have not helped you to this point so I would seek someone else for this assistance.

Tom Heller (lugerdoc on this forum) is an expert Luger gunsmith and not located that far from you in Missouri.

Marc

Here's some pictures of the barrel and a 9mm
bullet in chamber

The barrel clearly has been sleeved. Nice job.

Thank ya'll.Going shooting

Let us know how it goes.
dju

Yes - the barrel has been modified from 9mm to something smaller. The question is what exactly...

The fact that you had difficulty cycling the gun with .30 Luger ammo means that something is probably not completely right. There may be a problem with the chamber and it's size or inner surface.

Again, someone with experience needs to take a look at this.

Well, yep, Rons right of course...it's relined to .30.....but how is it chambered? You said the fired brass is overly expanded....can you post a pic of one of the fired cases?

ID Cartridge
 

Hi,

You might be lucky and find out it is chambered for somehting like the 7.63 Mauser which quite a bit longer than the 30 Luger. I am not a reloader but I am sure someone on the forum could give you the accurate dimensions of the two.


I once saw a gunsmith pour molten sulpur down the muzzle of a rifle with the bolt closed. When it cooled he extracted the pretty good replica of the cartridge. I remember it was a French cartridge, 8mm Lebel.

There maybe some other resins that would do that job today, as that was some 70 - 75 years ago. Good luck.

Aldo35

Aldo35

Brownell's sells a material for making a mold of an existing chamber and bore if it comes to that. Let's just hope that it is a simple sleeve to .30 Luger.

The main thing do not shoot this until you know the cal. and condition. Bill

A few years back Mr. Tinker sold me a 1912 military DWM that had been converted to 7.65. Shoots good, no bullets rattling down the bore.

Hey everyone went shooting yesterday. Luger perform good no hiccup. thanks again. OK what does the marking on right side and barrel mean?

Can anybody shed some light on the proof stamp on the forward sight base, (a "circle N"?, See photos of muzzle end)? I don't think I've seen this one before.

Thanks!

Just by chance, Eric (Cirelaw) has just posted the answer to your question Doug... in his interesting post thread. Check out the narrative in this photo:

http://forum.lugerforum.com/attachme...1&d=1436288265