Mauser "2-digit"?
 

I have a P08 that I need some help identifying and an opinion as to price. This came from a friend of mine who's Dad was stationed in Germany for a time immediately following WWII.

The pictures would suggest that what he has is a "Mauser 2 Digit Date" Luger and given the shape it's in, I'm guessing might fetch between $1500-$2200. Did I get the identification correct? It also looks like the holster may have been bought at the PX? Is it American or German? The pistol has 1 matching magazine and one aftermarket magazine with an aluminum base and a stamping "MADE IN DENMARK".

All the components are matching numbers. It has some bluing wear from the holster but the chamber and barrel internals look practically new. This is the first anyone has seen this gun since WWII Germany!

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I think that the value is likely if in good, matching condition, if in really good condition, towards the higher. The thing is that the pictures are not clear enough. It is a Mauser Banner, two digit, meaning it went into the army.

The holster is just a commercial holster, low value, but nice to have.

I am curious what you mean by the mauser two digit. Is it the fact the year on the top says "42" instead of "1942". And if the two digits went into the army saying "42", is there a commercial style mauser that says "1942" on the top of the gun?

Some 1942 chamber dated commercial mausers were ordered by police according to police lugers book.
looks good I would say 86 percent blue , 30 percent straw. but what do I know :).
bucheimer isnt around anymore my .22 cowboy action sits in one of his holsters.

This looks to me like a 42 dated Commercial Banner. It is in the correct serial range, commercially proofed, has straw parts. Is there a Eagle over N on the front of the sight block? Is the barrel serial numbered? Is the barrel marked s/42? Is it 9mm or 30 caliber?

Mauser 2-digit
 

Hi Steve,

The proof mark looks like the Mauser #48 proof on this forum's ID page. I never thought to look at the front sight base. With my old eyes, all I can see is an eagle proof mark. It looks like there might be something just to the left of the eagle but I can't make it out. I can't locate a serial number on the barrel anywhere. All it has is the air gauge size of the chamber (8.83) which I think makes it a 9mm. Every part that has a visible stamp is "54" which I believe makes it matching numbers. The bakelite grips are pristine: no cracks or chips anywhere.

My buddy is in no hurry to sell it but he has no use for it and it doesn't hold any sentimental value to him. I'm in California, so I may put it up on this site and Calguns. If it doesn't sell, I'll move it over to Gunbroker. He would like to see it go to someone who appreciates these guns. It appears much better than a "shooter" to me. I removed the slide today and it looks like it was never fired on the interior.

Thanks for the help. It is much appreciated.

I was thumbing through my gun books and found the description as "Mauser 2 Digit Date" in the 2008 Edition of the "Standard Book of Firearms" by Dan Shideler. It fits the description perfectly. He states "There were approximately 2000 manufactured for sale to Nazi political groups." He says the 2 digit date stamp was the year of manufacture (either 41 or 42). 1942 doesn't appear anywhere on the gun. Sorry for the fuzzy photos but I needed to reduce the resolution to get them down to the 200KB picture size limit on this forum. Thanks for the help!

Hi Edward,

Thanks for the information. I can get better pictures to you if it would help but scrunched them down so I could post them here. I thought the holster was probably commercial. The interior of the Luger looks new to me. If is was fired, it wasn't fired much and was well taken care of. The bluing is worn where the frame rails contact the leather, but other than that, the finish is pristine (except for 70 years worth of dust and grime).

It is a nice looking commercial banner. These pistols were sold to anyone besides the army who were able / allowed to purchase pistols. This includes private sales, police organisations, political organizations and probably some small exports here and there.

42 on a commercial version just means that they used a 42-dated receiver, that was probably left over from the military production run (which ended in 1942). Chances are that it was assembled and sold anywhere between 1942 and 1945.

should a noncom. ser. placed be straw?

These are found in all kinds of different combinations; with or without proofs, with strawed or blued small parts, with bakelite or wood grips. Over on the other site, 46 pistols have been recorded in this serial range and of those 46 there were 16 different flavors noted. Only 2000 or so of these in this particular range of serial numbers.

w block list
 

Is there an available list of known w block Mauser Banner Lugers?

I think your above chamber area says "42" instead of "1942" and the Mauser Banner is something I am not familiar with. I have read the thread and know your gun is Mauser by the Mauser Bump but whether it was Military or not I don't know enough. I see where other posts say it is commercial or some such and to tell you the truth I don't think it is Third Reich issue from what I know.

Lots of Luger pistols were made for civilians and Swiss and such commanding extreme prices. The moment a P-08 seems hard to define is the moment to figure it out after careful and timely research. The next thing I'd ask is if it shoots reliably without a hiccup. If it hiccups I'd get rid of it. Who wants a pistol that cannot function?

I have no straw to throw into this post. I have seen "strawed" P-08s and when I do they are rather costly. They are for serious collectors who collect and decide never to shoot the gun for function.

I only own working guns and I will not own a gun that doesn't work. Period.

After all, I have 1873 Colt Single Action Army's in .44-40 WCF and .32-20 and they shoot to this day with the finest accuracy and reliability.

Jump ahead to WWI or WWII in a Luger P-08 and if that won't fire reliably I have no interest in it. I'd rather have a Colt Frontier Six Shooter shooting .44-40 WCF and be done with it.

I will not ever own a gun I cannot fire today for effect. I have no safe queens or priceless relics that can't be fired. I have an 1873 Colt Single Action I can fire to this day.

What the ? That is your opinion, so why are you pushing it so hard?

I would buy a few books and then decide if it is military or commercial. Although I understand what is said above, I disagree, if it is dated, the I am of the opinion it was bought for the army or police - a non dated commercial piece would be a Mauser Banner non dated IMHO

I don't own German Police Lugers. I own S/42 Soldier sidearms under the Third Reich. I own no Commercial or other. I won't own Swiss or Navy or some other. I will only own a true sidearm issued to the Third Reich. I am not a "collector" of rare Swiss or Navy Lugers. I am a Soldier retired and I want Soldier Weapons instead of rare things. I want Soldier Weapons that fire and work TO DATE because I like FIRING my guns.

Is this a collecting forum prejudiced against working P-08s like I have?
Tell me now and I'll get the hell out of here.

Being more or less the resident grump, I'll say it.

You come across like you are about 15 years old.

Some of your other posts support this as well.

Repeating semi related rants from various angles in the same thread make my head hurt and serve no real purpose.

A lot of us have been around the block a time or twice and appreciate a good story.
Not so much disjointed ramblings.

Actually, many people want a pistol that cannot function. Cutaway is a typical example. If factory, it usually goes higher than normal production pistols due to the volume is tiny. It could go very high, out of my reach, but who's bidding on those?? Must be dedicated collectors who have many instances of that type of gun. It's hard to imagine people could interest in it if that is not in their main domain... the reason is simple -- it's not functional. For its collectors, it's a rare find.

Even for normal pistols, if has one, it's surely for shooting. Starting from 2 to above, there are many combinations of ways to play this. Typical collector have 20-30 guns of same type, it's very uncommon to see him shooting all of those, due to curiosity is out of picture. The "I shoot everything that I have" statement typically implies different types of guns in the collection so shooting curiosity goes on and on. Even for same type of guns, say, firing 4" Luger is different from firing 8" Luger, there is a driver for shooting.... but firing a 1936 S/42 is not very different from firing a byf 42.

If someone had experience on firing Shansei .45ACP Broomhandle, please post a range report. Really curious on it's working or not.... Don't know yet. I mean, genuine one made in 1920s.

Fire away!
It's your guns.
If you break a part on an all matching numbers gun and or ruin a collectible it's all you and your dime.

This is an old story, and again I'd like to say that really vintage guns should NEVER be refinished, modified, and fired, because it might ruin any value they had as a collectible firearm; then it's just part of a personal choice.
IMHO.

Point taken and I appreciate your honesty.

I don't think any of my matching parts are going to break anytime soon with firing.

The joy of owning a Luger P-08 (to me) is the firing. They are extremely accurate compared to the Beretta M-9 in 9mm as well as the Hi Power Browning in 9mm as well as the Czech 75-B or Czechoslovkian before the "B" model of CZ 75.

I like 9mm autos and I've had quiet a few since the 1970's. Even the SW 59 and 39.

My opinion is shooting a P-08 is more fun than shooting most other 9mm semi autos made today or yesteryear. There is another 9mm I have that I enjoy, the SIG P210. I enjoy the Hi Power and the P-38s along with the CZ-75 and Beretta M-9.

On the other hand, I'd like to own and collect more P-08s at this time that I would not fire because I already have enough firing P-08s and others to feel fine shooting just them.

My next endeavor might not be an S/42. It might be a .30 Luger P-08 to shoot a couple of times and put away!

I think you are swaying me to really dive into some rare P-08s but at least I am admitting it now.

Response
 

As the initiator of this thread, I guess I'll jump in. I get notified every time someone posts to this thread, so out of curiosity, I've been lurking and following along!

Anyway, the original pistol was sold shortly after I posted to this site by a long-time member. He was very happy with the price and once he received the pistol, the overall condition. Me and my friend were very pleased that it went to a good "home." The member knowledge and helpfulness on this site have been superb. Many thanks to all that assisted.

I didn't shoot this P08 but I have shot a friends P08 many times. I'm dumbfounded by the accuracy. I'm sure it's a result of the fixed barrel and high quality manufacture. I suppose this may have been a detraction for this weapon in war use since the toggle system, while being accurate must very very tough to keep clean in battlefield conditions. I shoot a Glock 17 in IDPA competition and although not pretty or accurate, the thing is as reliable as a hammer.

I shoot at least once a week and have quite a few semi-auto and revolvers. The only gun that I own that comes close to the P08 in accuracy are my H&K USP's. My Beretta 92FS and Browning Hi-Power are nice guns but are nowhere near the accuracy of the P08. Like Johnii, I shoot pretty much everything I have but I do collect long guns (Winchester 1890's). I shoot those on special occasions but there is little chance of breakage with .22 WRF's and for the most part, they are safe queens. ;)

Hi Phil,

Thanks again for the Banner.;) Honest piece, more pics below.

You say all matching components. Does this also mean the firing pin? Did you take it all apart to see all matching? The Germans did this with all parts stamping serial numbers. Take it all apart and see if the serial numbers go all the way down to separation of parts. If you find a mismatch with the firing pin then you have a mismatch according to Luger P-08 standards here and elsewhere.

PS.

Tell me about the front sight picture with the Eagle. I am unfamiliar with that sort of thing since witness marks the Germans did for the front sight.

The stamp on the front sight from the barrel. It has an eagle.

Why?

I know why.

No person on this forum saw it or recognized it.

No person on this forum is capable of identification.

I posed a reasonable question here with my 1936 and aside from saying it's reblued with a poor holster I have yet to receive a response to the mark ahead to the serial number:

http://i478.photobucket.com/albums/r...ps2eee58ff.jpg

I think I've depleted all information from this forum. No one here can answer concerning a simple P-08 MAUSER S/42 from 1936.

I think this forum is full of a lot of people who really know nothing.

They all like Luger P-08s but they don't have the answers.

Sorry that we are not up to your standards. Good luck elsewhere.
dju

Lordy, you are very impatient. You post three times; 2:27, 2:29, and at 2:31 and now you saying no one on this board knows anything about lugers. Take a chill pill and come back when you can post some civilized and readable questions. Maybe buy a few books from the authors that frequent this board.

As to the E/N on the front sight that is a commercial proof mark that is found on Mauser Banners.

As to the mark on your 1936 it looks like an X but can't tell for sure from the pic. If it is an X, it is a Russian capture and went through an arsenal re-work postwar.

"I think I've depleted all information from this forum. No one here can answer concerning a simple P-08 MAUSER S/42 from 1936.

I think this forum is full of a lot of people who really know nothing.

They all like Luger P-08s but they don't have the answers."


All right.

That's enough.

Now my Gunnery Sergeant is kicking in. Ignorance can be cured, but "stoopid" is forever.

You're bad mouthin' the most knowledgeable people on the friggin planet when it comes to the Luger. And all this when you insult our intelligence by hawking a fairy tale about a Polish Cavalryman named (wait for it...) Brown with some BS about somebody shooting somebody and krauts being trained to shoot the P08 at (Jeezus wept!) 500 yds!

I'm too damned old and tired to put up with people peeing down my leg and telling me it's rain.

You have NO credence with me and, to keep the "Gunny" in check and my blood pressure down I will henceforth ignore any thread or post you may place here.

I bid you good day; and don't forget to take your meds.

Gunny John

Steve, I think he may have been referring to the pic of the Banner Mauser in the latest set posted. The very front of the sight block appears to have a very faintly stamped eagle on it. Or am I having an attack of pareidolia?

D.P.

No, your teeth are OK...It's an upside-down straight-armed eagle...One of the more cartoonish ones...Funny place for it...I'd say red flag time! ;)

Well, I changed my mind, and quit arguing with this guy. He's just trouble IMHO.

Your ok, it is an E/N on the front of the sight block. You find 'em on Banner Commercial and Police models.

No red flags for the eagle, perfctly normal.

I'm not convinced...This has been brought up before, but I don't recall the consensus of opinion on it...

Your restraint has been admirable... ;)

I've been on this forum for a few years and I have noticed a clear pattern and profile for idiots like this last one on every forum I visit. Generally from post number one you can tell that they will soon flame out. They start out nice, then get weird, then get arrogant, and then finally throw a tantrum and get banned. One of my other interests is restoring and racing old cars (British) and I was once the sole moderator/admin of a forum related to such. Note "was". When the forum members aren't civilized, it completely strips the fun out of the hobby.

I just want to say thanks to the admins and moderators. You do a good job of establishing and being consistent with the rules. While I'm at it, thanks also to picture posters, guys that sell things, guys that tell the good stories, and the regulators that call out idiots. I come here to mostly gawk at Lugers, but also because it kind of reminds me of spending time with my departed Grandfather (no offense to the old-timers!) This forum is full of fellows that have mastered the fine (and dying) art of being a gentleman; just like both of my Grandfathers. Many thanks for that!