Incredible Artillery Rig Available
 

Hello, my name is Robert Risinger and I've been a forum member for several years now however have not posted much other than to notify members of better or fine Lugers I am selling through auctions. Please take a look at RIA Auctions for the following pieces I'm selling through, as some here may be very interested: lot # 1596: 1914 (1915 dated) LP-08 complete and full matching rig very special, read auction description, lot # 1594: '02 Carbine excellent, lot # 3546: '00 American Eagle outstanding (no import stamp). There are others too if interested just ask! I have more pictures and information on each of these. After looking, please let anyone else know if you think they may be interested.

These pieces are from my personal collection, and have been in my family for many years.

Thanks everyone!

Robert

Thank you for the notice. I have one 1915 dated matching Artillery rig. Yours looks to be better than the one I have. But I feel that the bid price should be the price and have a buyer's premium etc added to the bid. So I will pass.

Robert, nice to tell us, but if a member for yrs, how come you didn't offer here on the the forum first?

I believe they also charge seller certain amount money, is it 15% of hammer price?

20% or so. I understand reductions can be made depending on what is cosigned.

I agree with Mr tinker, a member since 2005 ,
should know to list here first.

True dat.

Group of people willing to pay are not necessarily being the same group of people know what they're looking at. Many bidders totally depend on domain experts to tell them what it is, and depend on seller's reputation. So RIAC selling has RIAC selling's advantage.

So, it's better to have it end up on some rich guy's wall as bragging material rather than have it in a collector's hands, who would truly appreciate what it is?

Depends on the viewpoint. From the seller's, the more money he gets, the happier he is. (Which is why he was posting on this and other boards - in an attempt to drive up interest, thereby driving up his take.)

I see this mercenary approach more and more these days. I would rather see it go to a true steward of history than put a couple hundred bucks more in my pocket.
Just my .02

I listed a few guns for sale myself for a long time. One viewer told me, "Oh, I don't know why these guns are priced so differently, they all look same. I don't know this thing, I could be burned badly if I buy a wrong one." So, he's interested in the items, but he does not want to depend on seller to tell him what it is (that's correct), and he does not know whom he could consult. He should go RIAC then. Average quality on RIAC listing is high.

Hi Doug, Your idealism is praiseworthy, but unrealistic. The seller is entitled to try to get the maximum possible return on his investment. It's called capitalism.
Regards, Norm

No Argument, Norm. I guess my view is somewhat colored by living in Miami, where I have watched too many rich boys destroy nice things simply because they can.

I remember about 30 years ago collectors of original leather flying jackets, (of which I was an actice member) collectively boycotting Japanese millionaires who were buying them up in a frenzy at every gunshow and taking our history back to Japan, where the pieces sat until the fad had worn off and became boring. Who knows were most of these are today.
There are some things more important than money.

If the pistol were posted on either forum with appropriate pics and description, this would subject it to the scrutiny of those who are interested, knowledgeable, and--generally--conscientious. Through the process of open examination and discussion, "what it is" would be established.

Anyone who exclusively trusts RIAC's analyses/descriptions, in my opinion, is making a foolish choice. Yes, Norm, it's capitalism, which operates according to fairly obvious and predictable motivations and mechanisms. The recent post about the RIAC description of the 1902 carbine has been spotted as an exercise in obfuscation. While technically not untrue, the listing includes extraneous material and is effectively misleading, according to a consensus of the responses on this forum. RIAC has the professionalism to catalog lots with good pics, but their descriptions, I suspect, are composed by a handful of experts they employ/use.

Neither altruism nor pure motivation to price-gouge is exclusive when it comes to auctioneers/retailers as opposed to collectors ,although there may be general trends in these groups. We can see the difference between 'buy low, sell high" purely pursuing financial gain, and buying reasonably to enjoy, research, educate others, and preserve before passing a collectible along to another like-minded collector.
Norm is correct, it's personal property. And, whether we like it or not, not every Luger will experience the stewardship that most believe they deserve. We cringe at the notion of the Luger's hanging on some rich guy's wall merely as a status symbol. But few situations are either all black or all white. RIAC makes money on both ends, form sellers and buyers? Traditionally, "cutting out the middle-man" has worked to both increase the reward to the seller while reducing the cost to the buyer.

Alvin, you do not mention the venue in which you encountered "viewers" of your guns who were so uninformed and trepidatious as to pass whatever you offered. But, as noted, it certainly was not on this forum. We love the Luger, and are disappointed by not having had the opportunity for access to their images, schooled descriptions, or chance to own one of them.

David Parker

David, Well said!

David, I second Jerry's "Well said!"

I note that the forum member who made the original post, RDR, has not provided any further comment.

I would not buy from RIA. Not ever! I would be much more comfortable buying from one of our forum members who has long standing membership.

David

RIAC probably won't notice the loss. They were a feature on History Channel's "American Pickers" a few days ago. (The 'pickers' went to RIAC for an appraisal). Exposure like that is bound to get them more business, from both buyers & sellers. I recall that they also take out ads in high-end publications [Wall Street Journal]. That would indicate they are aggressively targeting the investment market. I don't really follow investments so I don't know if RIAC is an upstart in the auction market, but they do seem to be getting more and more business (bigger catalogs).

The RIAC auctions I have put bids in on charged 17% 'surcharge' on the winning bid. Plus shipping & handling.

I still prefer Gunbroker, but RIAC does offer inspection prior to auction. I dislike RIAC's bundling of items.

It's hard to find "gem" in RIAC Premium Auctions. Not because they don't have good guns, they have plenty of nice ones, but the price is high.

But, it's possible to find gem in RIAC Regional Auctions, mixed in sand. The gun could be rare, and the price could be right as well. The description is minimum, you take your chance, it's not unlike gambling. I have met a few guys complaining this -- some collectors even kept the unwanted "bundling" guns for years.

====

Probably not Lugers though. Luger is too hot on the market. Old rifles had more chance.

I agree. But it's a process. I mean, collectors building up experience is a process, including acquiring.

The guns that they are selling... well, some probably would outperform inflation, I guess most won't though. Real "investment guns" with very very low risk are guns like Yugo SKS, MN-91, Surplus P1, Romanian Tokarev etc, but they don't sell those.

A blind man could come up with more realistic prices!~~~ Eric

Robert, if you have more and desirable lugers for sale, why not pack some up and drive up to the Reno show the weekend of April 13, 14, etc. I'm sure they would get quite a bit of interest there.

I am not a serious Luger collector, but I marked down those three pistols, will watch their auction performance. Thanks for letting us know.

Watched the auction. Even bid on a lot, not a Luger though. There was a byf 44 P38 wrapped in oiled paper, #3488. Sealed amount $1200, BP included would be $1380. After submitting the bid, I started worrying about "is that bid too high for a byf 44??", but it's will be my first real P38, so I would give it a try. Lower estimate was $1400.

It quickly went $1800, so did not win it. No regret, it's not small delta. But,,,, well,,,, wait,,,, it's not $1800, I missed a zero, the winning price was $18000, or higher, $20000+?? I cannot remember, I collapsed.

In the last few years I've only bought from forum members. In addition to acquiring beautiful lugers and accessories. I've made friends for life and that alone is Priceless! Eric~~~

Just looked up proxibid.com on the byf 44 P38 mentioned previously. It's $1800. icollector.com displayed the final price wrong in the afternoon, or there was a technical error. It's high but not crazy.