Finnish Luger price?
 

Recently came across one, and was wondering if it was a good deal:

• 4.75" mint Tikka barrel
• no date DWM, SA marked
• 85% arsenal refinish, no strawed parts
• chipped left grip
• wood base mag
• frame, slide and some small parts match
• not import marked
• $1045

I really like the long barrel and I'm a huge fan of the Winter War history of the Finn guns, but I'm on the fence about whether it is too much for what is essentially a shooter. Any thoughts?

Welcome aboard!
Check it carefully for import marks. Sometimes they are very tiny and in inconspicuous places, on the boottom of the frame rail, etc.
It does seem like a lot of money, but if it has the features you want, and if it is a well serviced pistol that will last lots of rounds, then why not? Changing barrels alone will cost you several hundred dollars.
So, in a perfect world the price seems a bit high, but that seems to be what they are asking for those guns, and this isn't a perfect world. Time for you to do a gut check.
Good luck.
dju

You didn't say if it was a face-to-face deal, or Internet auction [GB, AA, etc]...Do you need to pay sales tax? Shipping? FFL fee?

I happen to be a big fan of the Finnish Lugers, and the Tikkakoski 4 3/4" barreled ones especially...$1095 without any other fees sounds reasonable to me...

...My $.02... :D

It would be total price including shipping, no tax, and my FFL charges $15.

I have not seen it in person, but the seller assures it is not marked for import.

I have been looking for a while and the finns dont seem to come up for sale too often.

Does anyone have a rough estimate how many finn lugers there are and how many of those came into the states?

I finnished!
 

Took your advice and committed to the purchase!

I've drooled over the long barreled Finns since I first saw them come in. When was that, 2006?

Would it be sacrilege to have Thor refinish it or at least straw the small parts since it has been arsenal refinished before?

What I mean is, are the Finn Lugers automatically viewed as shooters and I can mess with the finish with a free conscience, or does the cheap arsenal refinish have collectability all it's own?

Pics will of course be forthcoming as soon as it arrives.

I'd classify most Finnish Lugers as shooters, although I'm sure some forum members will take offense. My point is that having it finished (no pun intended) to your liking will not effect value. Although the money you spend will probably not come back to you later either. Some of us need Lugers to mildly personalize and this one seems like a good place to start.
dju

You got $1060 into it and you want to spend more to refinish a shooter?

If it were me no but what ever makes you happy is what you should do.

Why don"t you post pics here first before you decide.

I will definitely post pics once it arrives.

It is probably silly and a waste of cash my wife will never forgive. My thought is it might make a nice shooter I can pass on to my son, who won't enjoy it now as he is just a toddler, though he might literally drool over it.

If it shoots great in range, $1060 is not unacceptable. Just treat it as an AR-15. Military gun with worn finish is a taste. I was a little bit surprised that Finnish Luger keeps value better than DWM in this economic environment.

My opinion is based on my personal preferences, and the 4 3/4" Tikkakoski barrel (especially with proof mark) is a big plus to me...and the 'square' front sight blade too, of course...

The SA proof on the frame/receiver is a big plus too...

The Finns seem to have taken pains to keep these Lugers in good condition; finish (sorry; no pun intended) perhaps was not a high priority...

I've kept an occasional eye on these on GB and the price is not out of line...IMO...Especially with only $15 FFL fee...

Does any Luger really lose value??? :confused:

I too would like to see pics... :thumbup:

No. Numerically, it increased in value. Back in 2006, I saw a Finnish Luger and a Shansei 45ACP Broomhandle in a big Maine dealership. If I remembered right, both were about $800. Both demand higher $$ now. If put inflation into consideration, so far Finnish Luger keeps value, and Shansei, not sure what's going on, it's selling at $1500+ these days.

Below are the photos from the seller. The front sight is not square, and the rear does not seem to be cut either. I wonder if that will affect the point of aim...

I will take close-ups when it arrives if anyone is interested.

http://usgun.cust3.dcsny.com/dimages/or_4594.jpg
http://usgun.cust3.dcsny.com/dimages/or_4595.jpg
http://usgun.cust3.dcsny.com/dimages/or_4596.jpg

Has anyone here fired a Shansei? How was the accuracy/reliability?

I have one C96 with ~90% original rifling that shoots a bit to the right, but fairly tight groups and 100% reliable.

Another C96 that is a reline is a disaster: inconsistent and has jams every 2-3 rounds.

I fired a Shansei in range, 10 rounds only. Jammed 4 times -- all due to feeding failure. At least that instance is a "looking-only" gun, not because it's a collector gun, but I had no other choice. Sold later. It's an easy gun to sell -:)

Are they all that finnicky?

I have seen 2-3 Shansei's at gunshows. They were more poorly finished than german made broomhandles by far, but I had thought maybe that lack of attention to detail would not extend to affecting the function.

Original Shansei were made 1928 - 1931 ?? I have never owned one of those, too expensive. The original one might work better. If you're interested in an original one, there is one for sale in the coming March 2012 Julia Auction. I believe this one being an original. If its new owner could give it a range test and post results, I will be very interested.

http://jamesdjulia.com/auctions/cata...e=320&lot=1071

(This gun, along with another one, were sold in 2008 from the same auction house. On sale again now).

What I owned was a parts gun imported in 1980s. Let alone shooting it, putting it back after disassembling was not easy. Much cheaper though. For looking, it's not bad, but it does not fit my collection well, so I sold it.

===

Sorry, off topic.

Sorry, by Shansei I meant the 80's reproduction 45acp broomhandles. What would the correct terminology be for these "Shansei-types"?

I've never seen an original in person. The repro's always piqued my curiosity though...

Big Fans of Finnish pistols should Email me at jkaler48@yahoo.com for a free draft copy of my book
Finnish pistols and revolvers

I had a Finn Luger with that barrel,
I did have to make a front sight that was taller by a bunch to make it point of aim.

This will, of course, be a matter of opinion--mine, in this case.

Finnish Lugers fall into the categorical crack of being collection-worthy, but generally in a condition sufficiently distressed that shooting will not harm them.

From the pictures, this appears to be a nice example, in pretty good shape. An "arsenal refinish" is authentic; a modern reblue makes just a re-blued gun. Refinishing it in any manner will wreck its collectibility, reduce its collector value by thirty to 50 percent, make it a real shooter-only-quality gun.

Looking forward to seeing the pictures when the gun is finally in your hands.

--Dwight

It has arrived!
 

Arsenal finish is quite nice. The pistol is covered with tiny bumps scratches, and nicks, but they are mostly under the finish. They certainly did not polish it before rebluing. I like it...

In the first description the seller had said "most parts" were matching. When I asked him to clarify which, he said all the ones he could see were matching but he had not taken off the grips or checked the firing pin. HA! The only parts that are matching are the slide and frame. Certainly doesnt bother me much, as I would have expected a finnish luger not to match, but I was secretly hoping I had an oddball that had somehow made it 90 years in one piece...

Frame and slide are 1834. Front trigger guard number also has a cursive "L". Slide is (SA) marked and nitro proofed. At least the seller was right when he said it wasn't import marked, I checked everywhere and nuthin'.

At first inspection there was some shiny goo all around the edge of the grips. My first thought was that some previous owner had epoxied the grips to the frame. When I removed them, they came off without any trouble. It turns out the whole inside of the gun was caked in grease. Not as sticky as cosmo, but same color. It had hardened in a couple of places to almost a tree-sap-on-your-windshield consistency, but came off easily enough. My wife chanced to poke her head in right when I had disassembled everything, and she asked "is that maple syrup?" :rolleyes:

With all the goo I had to clean out, I suspect any previous owners must have not fired much if at all since it was imported. The barrel was really clean too.

Magazine is wood bottom with a chip and nearly illegible +280 with no SA marking and a small dent in the body. The grips have the standard chip, but look pretty cool otherwise. I'm happy with it as-is and wont mess with the finish. After I fire it and check the point of aim, I may have to hunt down a square front sight. If anyone can point me in the right direction it would be appreciated. I would also like to know if anyone can explain what the most current interpretation of the laws are regarding reproduction stocks on 120mm Lugers.

I took some photos with my iphone. They came out terrible. I'll try again later when I'm less tired.

I have SA marked 1836 "L"...

So was part of the finnish luger purchase new production consecutive numbered guns? I was under the impression it was all existing war surplus and commercial inventory, and not any serial number range to speak of.

Aaron, if the Luger in question was issued with a stock when it was new, then I believe it would be legal to use with either its original stock or a stock made specifically to reproduce it. This would include Artillery models, Navy models, and carbines. Therefore, if you slap a buttstock of whatever manufacture or vintage onto a 4.75" barreled Luger, since it was never intended to have one, despite a stock lug on the gun, would be illegal for use.
One weird thing about the rule is that one is not allowed to mix a stock from one model with use on another! Those with handy access to the regulations may help you out here by quoting from them, or add more info.

David Parker

It is legal to attach an ORIGINAL German or Finnish made Artillery style stock to a SA marked DWM 120mm barrel Luger. It is in the book Finnish Pistols and Revolvers.
You can obtain a copy by contacting me at jkaler48@yahoo.com.
And it is only 179.99 (just kidding it is a FREE draft copy as it's not finished yet)

Be careful. Unless this combination is SPECIFICALLY mentioned in the C&R list, then it is NOT legal to join the two.
I looked recently and there is no mention of an exemption for Finnish 4" barreled Lugers to use a stock, historically correct or not.

Check this site for info.
http://www.jaegerplatoon.net/PISTOLS1.htm

The proof is in the book!!!! Email me for a copy! jkaler48@yahoo.com

The article states that inventory numbers of m/23 dropped partly due to conversions to 9mm m/08. Does this mean that there is a different inventory tally of m/08s?

AGAIN....Just because it is a historical fact that the Finish 4" pistols were used and/or issued with stocks does NOT mean the ATF agrees with you!
Unless you can point to an official ATF ruling/variance for these Finnish pistols you will not be in compliance of US NFA law.

AGAIN the proof is in the book (as in a copy of the ATF letter)
Email for a Draft copy of the book at jkaler48@yahoo.com
which will be I hope worth your while to read and have as a reference until the completed book is published. Or you could wait
until it's published and pay maybe 79.99 or more plus shipping.
OH anyone else who wants a draft copy is welcome to Email me as well! It's FREE!

I can personally attest that the book is masterfully written and is an excellent resource for any fan of Finnish pistols.

I would also like to add that I will gratefully accept a heavily discounted price on the volume as a token of appreciation for my wholehearted endorsement. :p