1938 S/42 P-08 Side plate markings.
 

Side plate has an a inscription like a j.



1938 S/42 P-08
Serial number 4592 no block letter.
Upper serial number 4514, no block letter,
4592 - 4514 = 78 difference in serial number.
8, 81 bore gage.
2 magazines one with wooden floor plate with a proof mark and serial number 9809.
The other magazine is a typical magazine with no serial number.
Black P-08 hard shell holster has 77 on the back side.

My father brought it back from the war and I'm now looking into getting more information on it.

Thanks

Mike

Mike, welcome to the forum.

Not sure what a typical no marking base is.... is it black bakelite, or wood or aluminum?

Sounds like two GI's sitting around cleaning weapons and got parts mixed up or a put together from parts.

The numbers being close is good, but could be coincidence?

The sideplate looks like a erfurt (WW1) era sideplate.

Do you know of any story of how your dad got it or anything (see my signature for why :))

The 1938 is the year, the S/42 is Mauser and the land to land grooves is the 8,81 marking.


Ed

Correct me if I am wrong, but aren't I seeing 92 on the frame number too? Like you have a top from one on a lower from another? Check the trigger, take down, and all internals.
Also, is that an Erfurt stamp on the side plate?
dju

It appears that the entire bottom and sideplate are matched WW1 Erfurt (see stamp on trigger guard) and the entire top is a matched Mauser S42, lending great credence to Ed's theory that this was swapped from two matched pistols by GIs or similar.

The lower on the trigger guard you can see the Wehrmacht stamp. As to the upper the proof stamps are the same as all other WW2 that I've seen. As to the other magazine (typical magazine) it is aluminum with no serial number. My father was a paratrooper 501PIR/Dog Co/101st Airborne Division and picked this up off a German during the battle of Carantan. I always though it was weird with the different serial numbers. As a kid I remember seeing the paperwork for this and the Spreerwerks P-38 he also picked up, some how they disappeared.

Once field stripped the upper and lower internal parts all match to the perspective upper (except for the trigger which has 80 on it). I personally think with the difference in the serial number being only 78 (4592 lower / 4514upper) and the WW2 proof marks they were swapped out by mistake. Who knows for example maybe after qualifing and the guys were cleaning their weapons and somehow got switched out. Afterall this would make the two different serial numbers the same batch made and than shipped out to be issued to the troops.

Again the proof marks and other stamps all look like WW2 but whats up with the marking on the sideplate. I don't believe it to be a WW1 lower with that Wehrmacht stamp.

Thanks for the replies.

Mike

I'm thinking that more photos are in order here. A side shot of the rear toggle pin area of the gun, good photos of the front frame number and any accompanying marks, maybe a good closeup of the numbers and face of the takedown lever, and the numbers on the inside of the side plate and trigger. Also, look for any more of the markings like the one just ahead of the numbers on the side plate, including on the grip screws.
dju

Also, a good shot of the stamp on the front trigger guard. I have never seen a WW2 Eagle stamped on a trigger guard before.

I'll try and get to posting more pictures later this evening. In this 3rd picture from the top you can see the eagle stamp on it. I have a K98 Mauser with the same stamp on the barrel.

Mike

Here are pictures of the 1938 S/42 Luger field stripped. The first picture shows a German Infantry Assault Badge, Wound Badge along with the Luger and holster my father liberated off the German soldier.

More pictures of the field stripped 1938 S/42.

Mike

More pictures of the 1938 S/42. The only different number I've seen is that the trigger has 80 on it. Also have 2 holsters for this. One that came with it in brown which is pretty beaten up. It was made in 1916 (inside flap of holster). My uncle told me that my father wore it until he got back to England than wore it again during Market Garden. During the Ardennes (Bulge) he got the black holster from a friend.
Thanks for looking.

Mike

OK, I'd deferring to others. Seems that we have a Mauser lower, a Mauser upper from a different gun, and a totally different trigger. Am I, or am I not, seeing an Erfurt marking ahead of the number on the side plate? Reworked side plate?
dju

Figured since I posted just about everything might as well post the brown holster too. Why just mention it I guess.

Mike

Hi Mike, The holster you showed in post #5 is kinda interesting. It looks like it could be a converted WW1 Artillery holster. Could you post a well lit, and in focus, photo of the back? Regards, Norm

Norm,

The brown one? The black one has 77 on the back.

Mike

Mike, there are guys on here who have seen thousands of lugers.

I have never seen a german eagle marked there on the trigger guard before, WW1 markings yes.

The sideplate is a WW1

The gun may be mismatched because your dad and another guy got their parts mixed up or it may very well be that a luger was put together by a german armorer on the front before D-Day, although unsure why a luger would be made from 2-4 gun parts that early during the invasion. Anything is possible.

I would like to put this into vol III if you'd like, I give credit to the original author, just would need hi-rez photos sent to my email, 3-4 photos of the gun and other items and any info (like above)

email is ed_tinker@hotmail.com
.
.

Hi Mike, Both your holsters look black to me, that's why I said "well lit". The one I'm interested in is the one with the empty stitch holes shown in post #5. Regards, Norm
P.S. Sorry, post #9.

Well until I get the camera from my daughter this will have to do for now.

Geez Mike, You've got photos of two different holsters, both of which appear to be black, mixed up together. One of them was converted from a WW1 Artillery holster (shortened), and dated 1916 (or possibly1918). It originally looked like the one shown below. When you do post better pictures, please keep the two holsters separate. Regards, Norm

Ed can you shed some light on why a Mauser has strawed parts, did the early Banners have this?

All Lugers had the strawed parts up until mid 1936, when they began salt bluing the entire gun as a cost savings. Any pistol made before mid 1936 will have the typical parts strawed.

The transition from rust blue to salt blue was in 1937.

Hello Mike

I think that the magazines bottoms have been exchanged, just to get a nicer look... silver with silver ( your Dad should have done it ..)

The aluminium bottom was only issued with black magazines...

wood bottoms belong to the WWI period

It is well known that german troops on "West-Front" got any kind of remaining supplies... ( as for example 1896 Lebel rifles) could be that your Luger is a post WWI 3rd choice rebuild for " Landsturm troops "
There was not only Panzergrenadiers in the battle of Normandy ....

Wood bottom mags were also used during the Weimar era until 1929 by DWM.
Tin plated, silver colored tubes with aluminum bottoms "silver with silver" were used from 1930 to mid 1936 by Mauser.

Many thanks for this very interessting information Mike !

Does this mean that there are K ang G types with that kind of Silver/silver magazines or were these only used as spare magazines ?

On a hunting trip in NH and I'll post better pictures of the holsters and Luger when I get back. The black holster does have two sets of un-stitched areas in the front and back where it may very well be a modified artillery holster. Why would they do that when there were plenty of holsters? Maybe it was cost effective.

Mike

Almost all magazines used by Mauser, including spares, from 1930 to mid 1936, were "silver/silver". A few DWM wood bottom mags were delivered to Mauser in 1930, and used with their commercial production.