New Boy w/questions
 

Hello. My name is Bill Hulbert. I am 63, live in Washigton State, married w/kids/grandkids etc.. I am not a gun collector but own a number of firearms of many different stripes. I like guns and think everyone should own a gun or two and know how to operate them. Knowledgeable gun ownership a safer society makes.

The reason I have joined this particular forum is that I have in my possession what I believe is an American Eagle Luger. I will attach some very bad pictures as my good camera has gone on the fritz and my old one is, well...old.

This gun has been in my family perhaps from it's beginnings. I remember my dad showing me the gun when I was a boy. He was a bird hunter but not interested in anything but utilitarian shotguns. I don't know that he ever fired a pistol unless that was part of OCS training during WWII. On his death in 1986 I inherited several meaningful guns; this Luger is one, along w/a hi-grade Parker Bros double and an early Browning Superposed O/U. My grandfather was more of an appreciator of fine arms and these probably came from him. I know he purchased the Parker in Seattle in 1904. I was prompted recently by my brother-in-law, who is an avid gun collector, to get it out and do some research on it. I just remembered it as an old Luger, wrapped up in a silicone gun cloth, put into a hard case and hidden away in the back of the safe.

I have read some of the posts here on this forum and the Dwight Gruber database. Too much information! Overload. I am asking for help identifying my Luger and some understanding as to value etc.. If my description bears some adjusting I am certainly open to correction and being set straight. I just want to know the bottom line.

Let me start the description (pics attached) by saying that the gun is in AMAZING condition. The blueing is almost 100%, the straw is 100% as are the grips. I don't know enough to be able to tell but I don't think it's ever been fired. It has a serial number of 15146 w/various small pieces marked 146. Under the serial number on the front of the receiver it says GERMANY. The toggle is marked w/the DWM and the top of the barrel has an eagle/flag/6 pointed star engraving. That's all. No bugs (at least on the outside) or other markings. The safety is on safe when the lever is down, not up and it's not straw-colored behind when the safety is off. There are 2 magazines w/wood bumpers.

Any help or further questions are appreciated. Thank you Merry Christmas.

Outstanding!!

Made in 1901 ?

That is one gorgeous American Eagle. Congratulations on owning such a fine example of family history.

Charlie

No finer example.

--Dwight

Thanks for the kudos. Can anyone help me identify more exactly the year, make, model etc.. Also how does one establish value? I'm considering an insurance rider or other coverage for this gun and my parker double.

Gearhead--I can't give you a value but you should be able to get more than $10K easily. It is the most magnificent Original condition American Eagle I have ever seen. I never thought in my life I would see such an example.

Hell, if I had any decent amount of money I'd make you an offer. However, it was your Dad's and I honestly believe it should stay in your family forever.

Please remember---wipe off all fingerprints after touching. Wipe magazines as well. I'd try not to touch the straw peices much either. keep it in your silicone rag, inside a hard case and in your safe. I know this sounds strange but, try not to fondle it to much.

I would not only have it insured but would make sure it would be safe in your "fireproof" safe.

Hi Gearhead - I'm no expert but one of the things I would do with this pistol is have a complete set of quality photo's made of it. When it comes to insurance you can't have too much evidence that you did indeed have a rare and valuable item. Also, as stated before by others, wipe the gun down after handling.

Jim
Buckley, Wa

Don't know the value of minty 1900. Say $5k? Just a rough guess. 1900 is rare, but not super rare, we still see them here and there, my feeling (could be wrong) is that condition alone won't push the price to $10k. But .... which super nice gun's price is rational? So it could go .....

You have a beautiful and pretty magnificent early Luger. However, sharper photos taken in natural light without all the glare will be necessary to provide a more accurate assessment of the condition and value of your gun. Although it appears to be nearly pristine the images are a bit blurry. I think I detect a few tiny points of oxidation and/or wear. For high dollar guns every point off of 100% can mean the difference between $8000 and $5000. In order to be valued at $10,000 the gun would have to be essentially factory new in condition. I am not trying to be a wet blanket, but by the same token I wouldn't want you to have a false sense of worth.

My guesstimate was based on the 2 1900 AE Lugers on Simpsons. One reblued for $4.5K and another 90%, thinning straps, grips, etc...for $5K. These don't compare to what Gearhead owns although Ron is most likely correct that $10K may be an over estimate on my part. I do however think it would do very well at lets say, Christie's, Sotheby's, etc.

For something like this, I would want it looked at very closely, as it could be refinished (a chance is always there). And as others have said, that although very nice and original, the market can be fickle....



Ed

Look at the "GERMANY" stamp Ed. It has not been refinished.

I don't think its been refinished, but also hate to get a members hopes up that it might be a 10K luger by just looking at pictures...

Thanks for all the input. Value issues aside....what is it exactly? 1900? 1906? short barrel? Long? Navy? Russian? I know it's not soem of these descriptors but I want particulars if possible. Also, where would one go, nationwide, for an evaluation/appraisal? Can the gun be shipped to someone for that purpose?

As a 100% neophyte these are important, to me at least, questions.

And yes, Mr. Wood, there are several (4-5) very small points of oxidation. Very good eye. Again I'm sorry for the poor photo quality. My "new but broken" camera does an excellent job w/macro closeups.....my old camera sucks at it.

Again, thanks to all. Merry Christmas!

Merry Christmas to all,
You have a 1900 Commercial American Eagle 7.65mm with a 4 3/4" barrel. It was built in Germany for sales in the United States. Simpsons Ltd. offers an appraisal service. You can find directions on his website (http://www.simpsonltd.com). Congratulations on keeping this beautiful Luger in such wonderuful condition. You have something to be truly proud of.


Mike

I'm sorry Bill. We all got so caught up in the wonderful condition of your Luger we completely forgot to identify it. It is a Model 1900 American Eagle that was specifically intended for the US market. It is roughly mid-production so perhaps it dates from 1903 but can't nail it down much more than that. It has a "long" frame and receiver, with the classic 120mm long "pencil" barrel.
If you can get some nice clear photos of the gun, you can probably get a very accurate estimate of worth right here on the forum and save yourself the hassle of shipping with the attendant shipping cost and appraisal fees.
Thank you for sharing this treasure.
Ron

P.S. Mike beat me to the draw...again!:)

Again, thanks to all. As soon as I get my better camera fixed/replaced or borrow one from someone, I'll try to get some better pics and post them.

Is indirect sunlight the best for taking photos like we want to see? As well as not being a Luger guy I am also not a photographer. My camera work is strictly snapshot and Ebay oriented.

Also it occurs to me that a written appraisal by someone such as Simpson might go a long way toward providing whatever my insurance company might require in case of loss. Perhaps I should do both.

My gun safe is in my office....safe (pun intended) and dry. I have stored many guns for years with no problems.

I also wanted to address Mr. Tinker's concern about refinish/restoration. I can personally vouch safe that this gun is original. I know 100% all of the details of it's heritage/ownership since 1950. I believe that before that time
(1950) it belonged to my grandfather, as he was more of a gun afficianado than my father. It makes sense to me that my grandfather, having been born in the 1880's, served in WWI etc. would have owned such a gun. My father inherited several pieces from him right after the war including a SAA .45 long colt (now owned by my brother), the Parker double, a matched pair of flintlock pistols and several other less interesting guns. Since my dad was not into anything but 'meat' guns, he surely didn't buy the Luger. No one knows for certain, but that's my story and I'm sticking to it 'til proven otherwise.

No offense taken, Mr. Tinker and I understand your concerns. A few photos a fine gun does not make. Again, I'll try to get some better ones up on the board soon.

"Now I had $5k of damp funny smelling cash! That mositure would have played havoc on the pistols"
If that funny smelling $5K is too big of a problem...

spent $2k+ of it on Lugers already! A gun safe or normal safe might be fine, but it was my fireproof safe that got damp inside.

Jasta2 -

Some "fire proof" safes contain contain small synthetic balls inside their walls. These small synthetic balls are designed to release moisture when the safe is exposed to a fire. Your safe might be one of these.

Suggestion: Install a "Golden Rod" in your safe. These are small aluminum tubes, closed on each end, with a low wattage heater inside. They run on ordinary house current. The "Golden Rod" goes inside the safe, and you simply plug it in to an ordinary electrical outlet. Heat from the rod drives out moisture inside the safe. It is an inexpensive fix and they do work.

Congratulations on such a nice American Eagle.

Thanks Ron,
My safe just might have those 'balls'. My American Eagle will look much better when Thor works his magic to it. Just watched the History Channel's 'Christmas Truce' on the informal truce in WW1. Quite interesting.

Hello again. I have gotten my better camera fixed and have taken some extra pics.

And some more. The last of this group show a couple of the problem areas...around the end of the barrel and some damage to the finish on the barrel itself. Obviously not a perfect gun.

Please let me know what you think. Thank you.

Bill

Update
 

Since posting last I have sent this gun off to Simpson Ltd. for appraisal and they have confirmed its authenticity and rarity. I'm not trying to circumvent any Forum rules here but...what's the best way to try to find this valuable Luger a new home? I would be happy to post a scan of the appraisal if that would help.

I have bought and sold a number of more "ordinary" handguns over the years but always on a face-to-face basis with the seller/purchaser. This Luger seems like it needs a home with someone who will really be able to appreciate it. Again, not trying to break any rules....just looking for advice. Thanks!

Take the appraisal that Simpson's gives you, and if you are satisfied with the value, post the appraisal here and the gun for sale in our classifieds (no charge or fee for selling here) with the exact price you expect to sell it for. Read the selling rules in the classified forum... You can't ask for offers. Auctions are not allowed here. You must post the selling price.

Someone here will buy it, and then the mechanics of the sales process and necessary licenses and such can be discussed and you can do it all legally... right here. Most anywhere else you try to sell it, they will charge you a fee.

The finest example of a Model 1900 I have ever seen, even in photographs.... Congrats.

Let me add my $0.02 that this is a family heirloom, and once it is gone, it is gone forever. If it were mine, my great grand children would be admiring it in a family display case 50 years from now... I recommend that you don't sell it.

Bill, what's the best way to try to find this valuable Luger a new home?

One way is to offer it for sale here on the Forum. To do that you have to have a set price and offer it. Then it can be easily shipped to it's new owner.

Simpson's must have made you an offer? Or at least told you what they thought market price might be?

The estimates found on this Forum thread may mislead you..As nice and as rare as this pistol is the corrosion on the muzzle/sight and the ding on the underside of the barrel kick it out of the #10,000 range IMO.

You have excellent photo's by the way and you have been very straightforward with your presentation..It's still a beauty.

Jerry Burney


Jerry Burney

John and Jerry....thanks for the replies. I will advertise it here and see what happens. Thank you both!

If you want to really want to sell it, let me know, I'm a serious player.

Harry