1902 fat barrel discovered
 

I was lucky enough to find a 1902 american eagle fat barrel luger this past weekend, One problem someone parkerized it long ago. Whoever did it did a nice job as all stamping is still nice and crisp Has anyone else seen this done before?

the photo files are too big, Email me at wayne8661@yahoo.com I can send pics of the 1902 ae fat barrel luger

Send the photos to me at Lugerforum@gmail.com I will resize and post them for you.

Here are the photos sized to fit the Lugerforum server:

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/fbluger_002.jpg
http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/fbluger_003.jpg
http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload..._004_copy1.jpg
http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload..._005_copy1.jpg
http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload..._006_copy1.jpg

Looks sand blasted as well! Someone in the past made a possible $10,000 rare 1902 AE into a $2500 "rework". Kind of reminds me of the stock market!

Wondering why there is a spring at the grip opening?

Looks like the magasine spring. (wood buttom broken off)

Nice pistol but relly deserve a rebluing ;)

The magazine wood bootom has been broken at some point. I am trying to locate the piece that is missing. Can anyone tell me if I were to have it restored by a recognized professional would I be doing more harm than good?

Also It has been parkerized at some point I dont know when I dont know why, I wish it hadnt been done. It is what it is

Wayne, I believe that the even pitting on this luger is a result of having been buried for a while rather than sand blasting. I don't know of many restorers who would tackle a restoration of one this pitted. It would require extentive welding to do it right and would be VERY expensive. If you can find a copy of the 4th edition of the "Gun Collector's Digest" you will find a photo essay showing, step by step, Gale Morgan restoring a 20shot conehammer in almost the same condition. Also noted in Kenyon's "Lugers at Radom" that the 23xxx range Fat Barrels are usually commericals not marked with the AE on the receiver. TH

PS: If you can remove the mag from this luger, I do have perfect repro wood bottoms available, either unmarked or "Cal.9m/m" marked. Lugerdoc

Lugerdoc, I am not quite following you on the part of your reply. You mean only a small portion of the 23xxx fat barrels had the american eagle right?

Lugerdoc How can I get one of those repro Cal 9mm magazine bottoms from you?

Tom, on page 11 of Jan Still's Imperial Lugers, is stated that the serial range of the 1902 AE's reported up to serial number #23362.

Dr Buster would it be worth it to have it restored at some point or would it make more sense to leave it be?

Wayne, this is a difficult question to answer. 1902 AE's are rare and highly desired. It's a shame some unknowing gunsmith adulterated this piece and you're right, it is what it is. The metal would have to be buffed down to get rid of the light pitting and this would be obvious and lighten the markings. You might have to pay more for the restoration than you could get for the finished gun. I would not rush into anything. If this piece is in your possession, you might want to show it at some gun shows and ask opinions of "experts". I would also hope that some of our Forum members who do restorations could chime in with their estimations.

DR buster the pistol is mine , Believe it or not it was given to me. So I am happy just to have one of these rare pistols , I know the value took a hit because of its condition But I am still happy with the piece. Like I said it was parkerized and whoever had it done had it done long ago. It was stored in its holster in top of a closet for the last 30 years. Well since at least 1979. I am sure that didnt help it at all. Its still a rare pistol and I am happy to own it.

Kenyon's observations may be fairly correct, but AEs and Commercials are intermixed throughout 1902 production. Jan Still's estimate is probably more on target...I own #23233 which according to him would be near the end of the line.

Tom, I have that copy of 4th Edition of "Gun Collectors Digest". It was published in 1985 and is getting a bit difficult, but not impossible, to find. The restoration that Gale Morgan did on that 20-shot is next to miraculous. I don't think that restoration of this fat barrel would be nearly that difficult. The parkerization has left a rather rough looking surface, but I think it is mostly superficial and built up on the surface rather than etched down into the metal. It probably would clean up fairly well with minimal, if any, welding required. The problem is finding someone with the requisite skills to do a proper restoration. As discussed in another thread, most, if not all, of the folks qualified to do authentic restoration are no longer accepting new work. And as "drbuster" pointed out, even if you could find a qualified restorer, the cost of restoration might be difficult to recoup if it was sold. I do shudder to hear the term "buffed down"...proper restoration is mostly hand work, shunning the use of a buffing wheel as much as possible!:)

Who would any of you recomend to contact about restoring this? If I do decide to have it restored I want the best job possible. also what would the value of this pistol restored be and in its current condition what would the value be?

Wayne, again it is hard to say and Ron's post above is right on. I would advertise your wants on this and Jan Still's Forum. I would guess that your 1902 AE is it's current condition is worth about $2500-3000 and restored about $5000. But the big caveat here is that it may cost you more than $3000 to restore it.

http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthre...light=tomathvl

Take a look at this thread. Ken does refinish work for many dealers on the east coast. I don't know about the finish being rough; I tend to agree with Ron but without a hands on it's difficult to evaluate. If I owned this gun I'd have ken look at it and tell me what he thinks it would cost to refinish. He's very reasonable and does such good work and thats why so many dealers use him.
Tom

Wayne, nice find on the Fat Barrel.

I agree with most of the information that the other members have given you, with the exception of the value of restored vs non-restored. I have several restored guns, it's not that I am looking for them, but I am not as adverse to them as some collectors. I have always thought it better to have a restored piece in the collection than no piece in the collection. Value of restored Lugers are very much in the eye of the beholder, but I have always used the 50% rule, i.e. a gun restored to 100% of original finish should be worth about 50% of current Blue Book 98-100% value. As rarity increases so does the percentage of value. I would place the value of a restored Fat Barrel at $7,500 to 8,000 if it is high quality work and not just a re-blue. I think your gun would be a good candidate for restoration if you can get one of the quality restores to handle it.

Just my two cents, oh and by the way, I recently purchased a restored Fat Barrel for $6,000 because I thought it was under valued.

Thanks,
Bob M.

Bob M Thanks for the insight It will be awhile before I can have it restored anyway, But It will be worth it to have it done i believe. Right now I am just glad to own it.

I with you on that one.

I would say with your recent tresure find it would be a shame not to get it back into first rate shape.

Looking at the photos I'm in agreement that it appears that its the park that is rough and the metal underneth may well be in better than you expect condition.

I have looked at it ander magnification and it is not as pitted as the photos make it appear its mostly on the surface all markings are still crisp even though they look bad in the photos. Can anyone tell me where I can get a clip or at least a repro wood bottom for this? Also I have a holster with this its the brown type with a nuremburg maker.Would this possibly be the original holster that would have come with the pistol?

I picked up a Mec-Gar (made in italy) mag a while back for my shooter and it works great. Take your original along to compare as they make a few differant styles.

LugerDoc is the man for your replacment wood bottom. He posted back on page 1.

Wayne;

I have the name of a guy in Texas that did some restoration work on one of my Navy Lugers. The work he did was excellent, but he didn't know Lugers as well as I thought he did. When I get home I'll send you his contact information you can check with him on availability (it took quite a while to get the work done on the Navy, 6 mos I think). I recommend that you talk with him and then go over each piece of the gun and review what finish you want on it. When he did the Navy he didn't know the 200 sight marking should have been left in the white and not blued. There were also some stampings that had been buffed off that he didn't replace. I was surprized when I had this done that it was not as expensive as I thought it would be. He did a lot of re-contouring on the frame and receiver as it looked like the gun had been buffed and re-blued more than once.

Thanks,
Bob M.

Judging from the quality of the finish that Ken Karsted did on Toms shooter Luger, he woud be worth at least a phone call to see what he could do, how long it would take, and how much it would cost. I do not know how much you paid for it in its present condition, but I do not think you would go far wrong in expending at least $1000-$1500 on a good restoration. I think properly restored, the value would be in the neighborhood of previously stated $6000 - or more.

Ron this is going to be the part that kills you guys, I didnt pay anything for it I got it as a gift.

You're right...I'm dead.:eek: If you have the resources, go for a full-house restoration - you are going to come out waaay ahead. Congratulations. :cheers:

Thank you.

Hey Wayne, what is the current status of this project? Did you ever find someone to restore it? Have you sent it off?

Zamo I havent done anything with it yet. I am taking my time with it. Its in good hands now and to be honest I just dont have 3500 to put into it right now. I have 2 American eagles that need restoration the fat barrel and a 1900 so i am thinking it thru what to do next.

Okay It has been a while But I just boxed up the fat barrel to send off to Ken Karstead on Monday for an evaluation. I am keeping my fingers crossed.

IMO, if bore is excellent, pay $$ to professional restoring it. If not, you can refinish it yourself.

The bore is fine I dont think I will be attempting any home remedies on a pistol this rare!!

Then probably worth it. The final result will be more balanced. Please post us a picture when it's done. Most likely, restorers do it at home as well, but they are experienced and skillful on metals, no doubt.

I will keep the thread updated with the findings and hopefully the restoration

Spoke with Ken today, He recieved the my 1902. He told me that the metal is not in bad shape at all and the only corrosion he could see was a small amount on the barrel, He told me he could have it done in 6 or 7 weeks. I cant wait.

That is good news!
I think the park job might have saved it from any further damage.

Can't wait to see the job Ken is able to do on it.