Family find of 1908 Commercial Army Luger
 

I wanted to share this discovery with you. :-) Until recently, I had no idea how nice this gun was. I posted the details to another Luger forum and they educated me on the rarity of this piece.

My father was a Major in the US Army, stationed in Germany with the US military government after WWII. They were setting up the new city goverments and police departments. He doesn't remember what specific city he was in at the time. His friend was in charge of many of the weapon collection programs. They would redistribute some of the guns to the new police departments. Many of the confiscated weapons were distributed to the US Army personell to take home as souvenirs. His friend gave him this Luger and the civilian .224 custom hunting rifle. The quality of the hunting rifle was obvious but he had no idea the value or uniqueness of this Luger. At the time, he thought it was new. :-) It's been safely stored in dry environments and cleaned every few years since then. It now resides in my gun safe in Arizona.

Its a DWM 1908 commercial army, serial number 70830 with no lug. No date is stamped on the gun. All parts have matching serial numbers or at least the last two of 30. Including the original magazine with matching 70830 stamped in the bottom on the wood. The barrel marks are matched perfectly and is also stamped with 70830. Based on the serial number, I have been told, it was probably manufactured in 1914. Original finish.

Pictures:

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload...uger_copy1.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload..._left_view.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload...right_view.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/lug_area.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/luger_sn.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/luger_mag_sn.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload...er_sn_view.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload...oof_stamps.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload...rrel_stamp.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload..._top_copy1.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/luger_safety.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/luger_triger.jpg

[IMG]http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m...09_10_0759.jpg[/IMG]

Thanks,
Brad Garland

Oops, I guess I shold have posted this in the Commercial Luger section. Move this over if that's more appropriate.

Thanks,
Brad

"God looks like it just came out of the factory"

I said it on the other forum,and I'll say it again.

What a Luger to start a collection with!

........

Man that is sweeeet, on top of it being a fantastic piece it is also heirloom.

I'm glad you guys appreciate it. :-) I didn't have a clue how nice it was until these Luger forums educated me on what to look for. Thanks for everyone's help.

The sad thing is now that I understand the uniqueness of this gun and it's condition, I also understand I can't take it out shooting anymore. :-( We never shot it much anyway. Probably less than 100 rounds over the last 20 years. Now it will retire and just receive TLC.

By the way, thanks to the administrator who fixed my images in this post. All I knew how to do was upload the images and post the URLs. Much nicer having the images imbedded in the post.

I have a question on maintaining the condition of this Luger. Other than keeping the gun metal oiled, is there anything else I should be doing to protect it? Should the wood be oiled or is it better to leave it alone?

Thanks,
Brad

It is interesting that the serial numbers stamped on the magazine bottom are in the post 1912 small font widthwise fashion and not in the earlier larger font fashion stamped perpendicular to the magazine handles. This probably means that this pistol was converted (or diverted) to military use after July-August 1914.

Brad, keep a good gun oil on the metal. Make sure you keep the gun oil off of the wood. If it were mine, I would remove the original grips and get a set of reproduction wood grips to keep on it for handling. Preserve those originals in the condition they are in... A good furniture wax would be okay for the the wood. Apply it lightly and buff it off with a soft clean lint free cloth...

I am green with envy over your family heirloom. Congrats and good luck. Now you need to find you a "shooter" :)

I just checked the information in Costanzo's book "World of LUgers" and he shows the right frame stamp combination as belonging to a 1908 Commercial/Military test model. That triple crown X Eagle appears on no other year model. A very rare and beautiful Luger.

drbuster,
This Luger was military issue from the beginning and was constructed in 1914, so the magazine is contemporary with the gun.

Herb,

It seems with further inspection this gun is getting more and more interesting all the time. Any idea how many 1908 Commercial/Military test models were stamped that way?

drbuster,

If this gun was manufactured in 1914, doesn't it make sense the smaller stamp font would have been used originally at that time?

JS,

Thanks for the maintainance tips. For shooters, I'll probably stick to my .357 and 1911 A1 .45. I can shoot those until the cows come home without impacting a collector piece. I also have an original 1863 Sprinfield .58 cal black powder that is in great condition. Fun to have a little history stored away. :-)

Herb,

The 3c/X inspection set also appears on the 1914 Commercial Army.

Brad,

Jan Still ("Imperial Lugers") estimates 450 1908-pattern guns manufactured with these characterisitcs.

--Dwight

Dwight, I checked that year also, Costanzo shows a double Ec/X for 1914, not a triple. Now that don't make it gospel, just that ole Sam didn't examine one with that mark bearing the 1914 year date while preparing data for his book.

Ron, I stand "educated" by you once again! I had been under the impression that these militaries were taken from stocks of 1908 commercials and diverted to military use because of intense need for side arms by the military after the outbreak of WW1.

Dr. Herb,
In a way I think you are correct. Probably these examples were fabricated from 1908 pattern commercials on hand and because of the buildup were assembled and pressed into service in 1914. The 70830 serial number falls very near or within the range of the 1913-1914 Commercials. My "1913" Commercial is #71247 and my "1914" Commercial is #73650, both undoubtedly constructed in 1914. My 1914 Commercial Army is #69879, so you can see that this piece falls right into place with the rest. The C/X C/X C/X inspectors marks are the indication that they were "diverted" to military use.

I hate to disagree with my friend John Sabato, but here is how I would preserve the piece:

1. Remove grips and "detail" strip the pistol.

2. Soak all metal in Kroil for 24 hours or more

3. Hang and air drip dry for min 72 hours

4. Using a blow dryer, dry external and exposed metal surfaces'

5. Patch clean the bore

6. Spray ALL internals with Boshield

7. Reassemble pistol less grips

8. Wipe down all external metal with Renaissance wax

9. Apply Renaissance wax to internal and external grip furniture

10. Buff metal surfaces with smooth clean cotton

11. Wipe excess wax from grip exterior and finish with soft tooth brush

The Renaissance wax provides a protective "skin" that resists moisture, skin handling salination and similar bad stuff. An application such as this will last for years if not handled; if handled, simply wipe down with a Renaissance wax impregnated cloth.

Added bonus: it does not attract/retain dust and dirt.

Tom A

Brad,

Congratulations on a superb Luger in great condition. That pistol is definitely a 'keeper' and a wonderful family heirloom.

The easiest and simplest way to preserve it is to buy/order a small can of Universal Rig Grease and a Rig Rag/Wipe and periodically wipe the external metal surfaces. Also buy a good quality pistol pouch (made by Kolpin or Allen) where you can protect the pistol against the elements for long term storage. I have used this method for over 20 years on my collector pistols with perfect results. Keep the Luger in its natural condition using the best available product.

Congratulations,
Albert

As usual, you guys are loaded with a wealth of knowledge and experience. Thanks for the advice. I'll give it some additional TLC before storing it again.

I also have the original leather holster and loading tool with a second magazine. The Holster was cut down for "quick draw" so it's lost some of its value but it's still nice to have.

I assume the best thing for preserving the gun is too follow your advice and store it in an up to date gun pouch after careful cleaning and waxing. As far as the holster, any suggestions on leather preservation that I can do without further impacting the value of the holster?

Here are a couple pictures of the holster to give you an idea of the condition.

Thanks,
Brad

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload...ront_copy3.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload...back_copy4.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload...ter_inside.jpg

Just be very careful what type pouch you buy. Some will leave you with a rusted mess!

The good thing is I live in Tucson Arizona so high humidiy is not a problem. As long as I use a pouch that breaths and the gun is properly coated with oil/wax, I should be in good shape. I can't imagine opening it up after storing it for awhile and finding it rusted!

Some information on the 1908 CA:
1908 COMM. ARMY AND 1914 HOLSTER Jan C Still http://luger.gunboards.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1280

1908 DWM, COMM. ARMY, R.I.R.72 M.G. Jan C Still http://luger.gunboards.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=914

Thinking about selling this one
 

Hi, it's been awhile since I visited here. Well, my Luger described in this thread continues to hide in my safe with no appreciation.

I have been thinking that a true collector would get so much more out of this piece. The family heirloom aspect of it is meaningful to me but it seems like such a waste to just keep it locked away in safe.

I'm looking for advice on how to have it properly appraised and market it?

Your thoughts?

Lots of ways to sell it;

1. Get an opinion of value here and sell it here.
2. Put it on gunbroker.com and start it at a penny and what it goes for it goes for.
3. Send it to Simpson's or another company and let them sell it for you.


Legally you can sell it to a person across state lines if you ship to a dealer or to someone with a collectors license.


Ed

Any idea what something like that is worth? I was just curious as I may have a P08 being sold to me next week..thanks.. this board is filled with excellent info.

Your P08 can be totally different from this one.

condition, condition, condition means everything; then of course rarity (type, variation, etc).


So it could be worth $400 or it could be worth $2500


ed

as soon as I get more info other than it has the eagle grasping the orb with the swastika and a serial number 4475 with the byf on it...it comes from an 81 yr old vet who needs cash now unfortunately is ill and also has what he called a broom handle Mauser...supposedly all matching numbers for both guns and in very good condition..he said he got them when he was in the war...I bought a Colt 45 acp (new in the box) 1991ma and a s&w 45 long colt from him already but have yet to see the Lugers..
I will post more info. as soon as I can to get all the valuable info. from this valuable site..thanks Edward..

I would tend to lean toward passing it on to someone in this community.

My other hobbies have me very involved in other forums and the community there is significant and important.

Should I take this offline for discussion or openly discuss the value and who's interested in this thread?

Good point on the cross state line shipment legalities. I will be sure to follow those requirements. Thanks.

good to know as it is deserved for a fine collector. I live in the restrictive state of California..

For Sale Thread Posted
 

I posted a new for sale thread on this Luger tonight.

http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthre...512#post164512