Another newbie auction buy. How did I do?
 

Hey guys,

Well, somehow I managed to buy another Luger, my second. Not sure how it happened, to be honest. I saw a 1920 commercial in about 50% blueing condition but with all matching numbers. I've been looking for a shooter and figured that I'd toss in the first bid at the opening price of $500. What I didn't realize was that it was a fairly short auction and I wound up being the only bidder.

I'm not sure if I was the only bidder because I got lucky or if its just not worth the $500 bid to begin with. Did I mention I'm a newbie?

Anyway, here's the closed auction. I don't have the gun just yet to take my own pics, but this should suffice. Another contributing factor to this purchase was that I had dealt with this place before many times and their pictures always look worse that the actual gun once I get it. I trust Collectors Firearms completely.

So please, anyone, tell me what you think. Did I do well, break even or get taken?

http://www.auctionarms.com/closed/di...temNum=6622837

Thanks,

Steve, I believe this will be in .30 Luger. The seller dosen't say. Expensive ammo for a shooter. Not a bad price on the pistol though. Jerry Burney

Kind of rough, but not excessive price....

You got another luger!! That is the way to look at it, heck, its just money...

:)

Ed

Yeah Jerry, it's the .30. I don't care about the ammo cost as I don't shoot anything but my CCW gun very often. I did buy it to shoot, but it's not like I'll go through multiple boxes of ammo. In fact, if it's more of a collector piece than a shotter piece, I may not shoot it at all, except to verify function. I'm embarrased by the number of guns I have which I've never shot. Thanks for the confimation of price... :-)

Ed, between you and VIS35, I've been irreversibly infected with "Lugeritis". His reply to that acusation was that he must be the "Typhoid Mary" of Lugers.... :-D I really appreciate the help of the both of you, and a few others, in my edification of Lugers. I really do need to pick up a decent book, but the selections are so caried and many of the ones suggested to me are too expensive (like an $800 gun isn't :-P ) or are backordered. I guess it's time to go back to Amazon and check on them again.

So I did pretty well on my second attempt? I'm glad to hear that.... :-) Thanks guys....

BTW, is this something I should send out to Thor to see what he can do? Or would that just be wasted money?

Thor can make it a gun you will always be proud to own, but you will about double your investment.

Steve,
Pretty hard to beat Jan Still's books and the price is extremely reasonable if you buy them from him. He sells on eBay and through his web site.

http://www.gunboards.com/luger/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2535

Tom

I take that as a complimnet, cuz VIS35, he's a really nice guy!

The more collectors the better, as there are tons of guns out there, and each of us likes something a bit different...

:)

Thanks again guys. Maybe I'll reconsider Thors work. I'm sure he's good, but unless his work triples the value of the gun, it's just not worth it to me. I don't mind a slightly "preowned" look, I'm just scared to death of ruining the value, even slightly. And if his work doubles the value, it still doubles the cost. Damned if you do, damned if you don't kinda situation.... :-( But I hear his work is highly recomended.

Tom, I'll drop by and pick up one of Jans books right now. I really need an education and quickly before I buy again! :-O

Ed, yes that was indeed a compliment. But I've got to tell you, that bastage VIS keeps posting pictures of his collection on the Parallax Bills site and is driving me to run up my credit card bill.... :-P Ya gotta love 'em though..... :-D

So, at what point does one decide to sink that kind of money into Thors restorations? At what point is it worth the extra expenditure? I mean, other than just personal preference....

Steve,
The difference is, unless you plan on trying to sell it right away. Lugers double in value in just a few years. It will be worth a lot more down the road.

I would highly recommend talking to Ted [Thor] about redoing it. You won't be sorry. Shoot it first to get your enjoyment, because he doesn't do quicky jobs, but he is very ,very good.

I have nothing to gain from this recommendation. Just a word of encouragement.

Ron

Thanks Ron. I'll give it some consideration.... $500 is a lot to spend on "restoring" it though. Wouldn't restoring it somehow reduce it's value? I mean, what could he possibly be able to do to it that won't detract from it's value but make it more appealing at the same time?

I'm cornfused....

Hey Tom, there was a problem with your link. I need to be a member there....

Maybe I'll just try Amazon or something.... Thanks anyway.

Steve, easy to become a member there, it is Jan Stills forum. I am a moderator there, as I am here :)

PS: I sent you an e-mail or PM earlier...

Ed

Got it and replied...

I seem to remember registering there a long time ago, but I can't remember which address or log in name I used then and I can't seem to make the system recognize me....

I guess I'll just keep looking. I belong to enough groups as it is.... :-P

you can use the same user name and password, makes it easy, easier... I PM'd again.

You want to check it out, just e-mail me...

Because of their abundance, 1920 commercial Lugers are not in demand by collectors unless they are in virtually mint condition, and even then mint commercials can often be bought for $800 to $1000, so the cost of restoration doesn't make a lot of sense. Besides, the value of a restored pistol is not as much as as one with a nice original finish. What you have is a shooter worth $400 to $500, so shoot it and enjoy it. Yes, the ammo is expensive, so buy a couple of boxes, save the cases and do some reloading.

Steve,

Some WD40 and very fine steel wool will make that gun look 50% better!:thumbsup:

Thanks for the advice Aaron. I did buy it as a shooter, but I rarely shoot anything other then my CCW gun, in actuality. If I shoot it twice a year, that'll be a lot. I'm just going to have to be more discriminating on my next purchase (and liberal in my spending).

Hugh, that's almost exactly what I intend to do, but I'll use some of the fine machine oil in the machine shop at work. Somehow, it really does wonders with some 0000 brass or steel wool and machine oil. :-)

I do that with many of my "less beautiful" guns and it's amazing how much better they look while still retaining that lovely patina.

Guys, I'm really appreciating all of the advice and thoughts. I'm learning volumes here....

Aaron, 10 years ago you could buy a "mint" 1920 commercial for $400-$500. They have gone up just like every other Luger.

Ron

That's exactly what I said, Ron. Today you can buy a minty 1920 for $800 to $1000.

I sure haven't been able to find anything, not even mismatched junk Lugers, for less than $500, and that's why I was so leary once I learned my low bid actually won this one. :-O

I know it's no superstar collectable gun. I still can't really afford those yet. I'll get there one day, but right now I'm still learning about them and buying a multitude of other guns as well. I collect Colt Police Positives too. Don't ask me why, I just love them for some strange reason. Same deal with these Lugers, only stronger, if you can understand that.

You know what I really need to buy is a few books....

And I still don't have the gun yet..... :-P Now I can't freakin' wait.......... :-D

BTW, in case I've failed to mention this guys, I sure do like hangin' around here. Every post I read, I learn something.... :-) Thanks....

Pics now....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...0Mleftside.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...Mrightside.jpg

Steve,
It looks a lot better in your photos. Hugh was right. 0000 steelwool and some good cold blue would really dress it up.

In case you don't already know this. Clean the areas with steelwool and run hot water on it to warm the metal and open the pores, dry it with paper towels. Apply the cold blue before it cools. The blue will take much better.

Ron

Steve, you owe it to yourself to examine a Thor restoration before you decide. And I guarantee you that if you hold a Thor restored Luger in your hands, you will no longer question if you should send it to him. It will simply be a matter of when can you send it.
DougT

I vote for Thor!

Guys, I'm confused....

I was under the impression that any kind of restoration, especially rebluing, was strictly verboten on anything collectable. Won't it ruin it's value?

I'm all for making it look as nice as possible. I'm already making plans to take some 0000 wool to it and clean it up as much as possible, but rebluing?

I've been doing amatuer gunsmithing for years. Nothing for profit mind you, but always using the part of the Hypocratic Oath "First, do no harm" in my work. For example I'd never try and reblue one of my Colt PPs.

I've built an AR from the ground up (okay, easy I know) and I've reblued countless guns and gun parts (and some things that aren't gun parts). "Fixed" so many guns by simply cleaning them I could have made a living off of that alone........ I know my way around most guns in a little more than just a very general way.

Am I missing something here? Or is this gun considered kind of "less collectable" and could benefit more from a restoration than it could be hurt by it? ...

I'd love for it to look like new again, I'm just afraid of hurting any collector value it might have, if any at all.....

Steve,
Value is subjective. Your 1920 Commercial is at the absolute bottom of the matching number Luger food chain, simply because there were so many of them made. On the other hand, your Luger is an excellent example of the general type, and will make for a very sweet gun to own and enjoy. Last year I purchased a 1923 Commercial .30 in about 95% condition. This gun is identical to yours except for it's year of manufacture and condition. I paid more than twice for it than what you paid. As soon as Thor finishes the restoration he is currently doing for me, I plan to send him this gun because I want it to be 100%. My Lugers have the value that I give them, not necessarily what the market dictates. Again, I urge you to contact someone in your area who wouldn't mind showing you a Thor restoration, and all your questions will be answered. If you can't find anyone in your neighborhood, get a cheap flight to Los Angeles and I'll be happy to show you my Thor restored Lugers. You have to see them to believe them, and then you won't want anything less.
DougT

That's true, value is subjective. But Blue Book value isn't.

My fear is that fifty years hence when I'm long gone and my SO is selling off my collection to pay the bills (probably an Alaskan vacation, knowing her) that she doesn't have to hear, "Oh, I'd grab up that 1920 Luger becasue it's been reblued and that kills the collector value." I know that I've said it before about many guns....

Would it look prettier on my wall? No question. Would I be happy with the rework? Almost certainly.

Would it lower it's resale value (comparitive to the cost of refurb) is what I don't know.....

Steve,
Thor optionally puts his refinisher mark on the guns. In 10 or 20 years, this mark will be the equivalent of having an original, signed Picasso. How's that for "Blue Book value?"
DougT

Hmmm..... Actually, you make a good point. :-/ I may have to consider that.

The more common the Luger, the more the true collector demands it be in as perfectly original condition as possible. The rarer the Luger, the more a true collector will tolerate less than perfect condition. Your 1920 is only moderately collectible even in perfect original condition. The fact is, your Luger is useful only for plinking at the range and would only be of interest to a shooter or perhaps to an accumulator who wants to own something from the Luger family just as a conversation piece, even if refinished. You may get a cheap $75 Bubba reblue or spend around $400 or more for a professional restoration. In either case, a true collector will have virtually no interest as he will probably be able to discern that the finish is not original. Save your money for a nice Luger with a decent original finish, preferably in 9mm. Many are available at around $800, and if you can't find one, I'm sure some of us on this forum can help you.

I am building my collection from Thor restored guns. Give me 10 years, and they will command a higher price than any of their "original" counterparts. My restored Luger can beat up your original Luger!
DougT

Aaron, fortunately for me, it was my intention to buy this one for shooting. I figured that $500 for a shooter is a little high, but it was a matching shooter. :-) Now of course, my education is expanding and I'm thinking of having Thor spend some time on it. To me, they're all valuable.... Even if some of them are like the ugly kids.... :-P

I do have a 1938, 42 code that's in a little better shape than this one.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...s/DSCF0746.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...09leftside.jpg

I paid $750 for it and I'm pretty pleased. I know it's only one rung above the 1920 Commercial, but I'm just starting.... I'll probably pick up at least one more this year. But I'm afraid I'm going to have to spend some money on that one..... :-/

Doug, when I have Thor do his thing, I'll ask him to knock his proof into it.... My thinking on that will be right along side yours. It may be the most common thype of Luger, but it's been reworked by a master. Like having Stradivarius fix your old clunker violin.... :-)

Steve, when you post a picture, can you post it here? That way, the picture stays as long as the thread. I have seen many photos disappear (guy thinks it is taking up space on his site, it "times out" and disappears, site overloads and blows up, etc), yet these threads remain...

:)


Ed

Sure thing Ed.

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/image1.jpg

http://forum.lugerforum.com/lfupload/image2.jpg

I was just trying to make it easier on those with slow connections....

Looks like a pretty decent Luger to me. Does it have any problems?

thanks Steve, uh, actually meant posting it to the thread, that way, as long as the thread remains, the pictures remain. Lots of guys take their picture down after a month or so, which defeats the long-term use of this site as a learning tool.

BTW, I already copied them and posted them here :) As jpg's, they were half the size :)

Ed

Thanks Ed. I'm not sure how to post it to the thread, not having done that yet, but next go 'round I'll give it a look for... :-)

Aaron, that one is my 1939, 42 code. It seems okay to me, but I've only put one mag through it so far. I probably won't shoot it again.

The other one, the recently acquired 1920 DWM in .30, I haven't shot it yet. My thumb is still healing after a recently sustained cut.... A rather deep one I'm afraid. I'll have to wait a bit longer to see how it shoots, if at all....

Okay, I've shot the gun and it works great. Actually shoots dead on. I think this one might go to Thor soon.....