Please take a look and give me your thoughts
 

My grandfather was in WW2 and was ambushed in Berlin by a Russian squad. His group killed all the Russians and took this pistol off of one of the Russians. I'm looking for a value of the weapon for insurance purposes....it's never going to be for sale and will always be in our family.

Can you please help me with:
1. Estimated value
2. Should I look for a holster (don't have one) and another clip that matches to increase the value
3. Should I fire this or just keep in the safe as a family collectible item
4. Does the clip match the gun?

http://s258.photobucket.com/user/tac...w/WWII%20Luger

Thanks in advance for your help and thoughts.

Hi Tom and welcome to the forum, you came to the right place to get the answers you are looking for, give the members with the answers a little time and I'm sure they can help. Looks like a very nice Luger. :cheers:

Lon

Very nice looking luger. Is your magazine actually numbered to the pistol?

I don't see any numbers on the clip. I've been told it matches the pistol but was looking for someone to confirm that

Hello tackkjr
Welcome to the forum!
Since the real experts haven't jumped in yet,I will try to give you some information.
You have a Mauser made late war P08 Luger chambered for 9mm ammunition. These are commonly referred to as "Black Widow" lugers and usually issued to German Army units.It looks all original. The grips and the magazine are the original style that where issued with the gun.The finish looks good with some honest wear.The magazine on these guns where not serial numbered,so if you want a spare one,any one of a similar type will be correct.
As for value,i would guess @ $2500.00.
If you want to get the correct holster, look for a late war black military style with the metal buckle.
Since your gun looks all original,there is a danger if you shoot it,a numbered part might break and decrease the guns value.
If it where me,I would clean and lubricate it really good and shoot it some. Use low power ammunition like winchester white box.
Your gun is the strongest of all the Lugers made up until the 1970's.
I take it your grandpa was on the German side during the war? So he liberated this pistol from the Russians! Nice.
Congratulations
Bob

Actually grandad was a US master Sargent. I found it odd that they were jumped by Russians but that's how he told the story. His name is the one on the certificate from the US army

Don't store the gun in a holster.

Not a problem...don't have a holster for it. Thanks for the tip though, appreciate it!

I'll also be interested in the price put forth from the PROS with papers and without holster.
Jack

My guess. $2100. The capture papers are nice and add to the history but to me anyway do not add a great deal of value. I am sure to many they do. The $2500 figure to me would be top dollar. Nice luger. Bill

If buying $2500 Plus. When I want something I usually have to pay retail.

Hi Tom, and welcome to the forum.

Congratulations on your family heirloom and a very nice Luger.

As it's in original finish and appears to be all matching, it is a collectable Luger.

Is it a "41" dated receiver (over the chamber)? "42" code or "BYF" code on the toggle?

As it appears to be in the original finish, is in a high percentage finish state and probably has all matching numbers, it would be considered collectable.

If you want insurance values, look up something similar on the Simpsons Ltd website. That would be replacement value, and what you should insure it for.

I personally would never shoot it because of the risk of breaking an original numbered part. That reduces it's historical and financial value and just isn't worth the risk. Others differ from this opinion.

Clean it carefully. Keep it lightly oiled with a preserving gun oil. Store it away from leather (which can deteriorate the finish). Perhaps in a silicone gun sock or a zippered case.

Watch out for reproduction holsters if you decide to acquire one. Most can be fairly easily detected, but some of them are pretty well done.

Bill Lyon is right in there with the collector value of this Luger.

When you are documenting this, the suffix letter that appears under the serial number on the front of the frame above the trigger guard is part of the serial number if present.

Be particularly careful if removing the grips. They are easy to chip up by the safety lever.

i wonder if the russians were germans in uniforms they took off of some of the killed russians?

Russian capture... That kills it as a collectable!

Only kidding! I have heard many stories of American and Russian confrontations at the end of the war. So the story does not surprise me.

I agree with the value at about $2500 plus. Nice heirloom!

Bob

The inmediate post war era was much more complex and fascinating than most people realize. There were looters, bootleggers, organized gangsters, "Werewolfs", black marketeers, smugglers and goon squads. Old scores were being settled and more than one murder took place in those post war months that was never investigated or solved. Groups of soldiers from the various allied nations were competing for loot and war booty. Many made millions capitalizing on the chaos and comfusion. Confrontations like the one described were not that uncommon.
My Dad was a B24 gunner in the Eight Airforce, but was later transferred to Cherbourg, where he guarded German prisoners. He told me of one incident where Frenchmen tried to ambush them outside of a bar, (because of the Aircorps uniforms. Many French felt that the USAAC had bombed their towns indiscriminately). Only by pulling unauthorized, concealed .45s were he and his buddies able to walk away from the confrontation.

If this one had not lost the blue on the rib at the position under the toggle, I guess it could go $2500 easily. With this loss of blue, it's probably lower.

Thanks everyone. Since I see this piece as a family possession and not an investment I am leaning toward firing it a bit and allowing the family to enjoy it - all the while taking good care of it. Does that make sense?

Do you all see any real reason for me to pursue an authentic holster (not to store the weapon in obviously) and another clip?

Thanks again for your thoughts

yes, buy a real holster and not a repro

know that if you break a numbered part, it is now worth $600-$800 - this is always a huge debate, people saying these were made to be fired etc, that they are strong and everything - but the fact is that I have heard a dozen first hand experience, and two stories from me (from 'shooter lugers') that broke a numbered part

And, as you can see, I collect war stories - that said, no americans made it to Berlin during the war - but who knows, there were lots of 'conscripted' and lots of stories of russians who fought on the side of germany - could have been a unit like that.

Tom, Again, I'll answer your question. I do not feel that firing an all matching collectable Luger makes sense under any conditions.

Your results may vary.

Marc

Thanks. It's a "41" and not a "42" Thanks again!