whats wrong with these magazines?
 

ok, lets play, what in the world is wrong with these mags?

Those that instantly know, wait a day :)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Luger-PAIR-o...item3a7c6c04a7

Nice :)

(I'll remain quiet).

East German Haenel-Schmeisser mags with bogus Nazi bottums. I watch Revshops Ebay offers all the time and never see any bids on his stuff, The forums must be doing some good.

Spoil sport... :grr:

His asking prices also seem on the "optimistic" side.
Bob

Of course his attempt at faking one of the WaffenAmt stamps must have gone wrong, because it's been further ground off the base...

2/1001 being a part number used post war during the DDR era.

I bought one of these from Sarco when they still had them. Nice running magazine at only $85.

Too bad these have been faked up.

Marc

Sorry, I didn't see Ed's request to wait a day. This Revshop crap just really gets my dander-up so I shot off too quickly.

He tried to screw me with one of his bogus LP08s some fifteen years ago.

Well, at least you don't bear a grudge... :D

Collecting Lugers and their accoutremon involve a small circle of Friends..You tend to remember the crooks...

thank you Ed , this is what new guys like me need ...

+1

Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it...

Thanks, Ed. I hadn't heard of this outfit/guy before, and appreciate the left-handed caveat!

What I noticed about the mags: Though my experience is limited, it seemed to me that the striations left by the extrusion process are deeper than original WWII versions. Is this, in fact, a clue? Also, the installation of the retaining pin in the bottom of one of them is quite sloppy--a shiny mis-strike with the press/center punch, and a deformed pin head. Would an original, unmessed-with mag look like this? The mag bottoms' texture looks like an uncirculated coin--little marks from bumping into their neighbors in a parts bag or bin, but no actual, honest wear. And both of them are in about the same condition, something I found odd. Aside from the retaining pin screw-up, they look just about identical other than the vastly different serial numbers.

Are any of my observations relevant?

D.P.

I am sure they are, however, I admit, freely that I am not a 'exact' guy, it is a reason that Dwight and i wrote the book together, I am very good at gathering info, putting it together and Dwight is excellent at research and being very exact.

Obvious things on these mags:

1. The bases are (on original east german made) are darker aluminum, and likely more of a pot metal than the WW2 bases - Note that these have WW2 bases put on them....

2. The body style is excellent and was made on original tooling, I believe although some don't that Schmeisser themselves made these - if nothing else, then it was made on their tooling or expertise.

3. ALL of these magazines have the DDR marking of 2/1001 - instead of showing FXO, they used a code of 2/1001 - as soon as you see this, KNOW that the mag is east german, and with it, it is a great mag, great shooter and almost knew compared to WW1 and WW2 mags :)

[QUOTE=Edward Tinker;224566]

1. The bases are (on original east german made) are darker aluminum, and likely more of a pot metal than the WW2 bases - Note that these have WW2 bases put on them....

I would argue that the bases are not original at all. These are newly made aluminum castings. (Observe the sharp lines and pristine condition of both. Not a SINGLE ding in either base and the stamped serial numbers have raised edges. After 70 + years for BOTH mags to be in this condition? Really?).

Click on the magnifying glass, which allows you to closely examine the magazine base photo and all will become obvious.

A long time faker like you describe must own a handy, dandy set of fake dies that he can use over time as he injects the collector market by drips and drabs with these spurious magazines.

yes, you are correct, the eagle 63 immediately stuck out at me

The serial numbers may appear stamped because they are so shiney they look like they have raised edges, but they are actually pantographed. I am not all that up on WWII magazines, but I don't believe the serial numbers were ever pantographed.

This would bear out Ed's opinion of this particular dealer. This is willful fakery and clearly an attempt to defraud the novice collector.

I'll put him on my "S" list.

David,

One thing. The Haenel Schmeisser magazines (whether FXO or 2/1001 DDR era) were not extruded. They were formed and welded steel that was subsequently precision machined into their shape.

I still think that these may have been the best and most consistent Luger magazines. It's surprising that the technique hasn't been more widely used. Of course, stamped steel is cheaper to produce.

Marc

It's a shame there isn't a way to get the word out to prospective buyers/bidders on web sites like e-bay, crooks like this guy should be put out of business.

I agree completely. I have 2 of these and they perform as well on the range as my 2 Mec-Gars. Used them with my 1938 S/42 and my 1906 AE.

Another problem with the magazine on the left is that a SE/63 stamp is not correct with a center pinned mag bottom.

Tom