I would wager a guess they are made overseas and come in with a sticker with country of origin once in the hands of Gun Parts the sticker falls off ...... I have seen this in manufacturing where product is imported and a made in USA label is sewn into the bag/pack/etc......

drums....
 

Hi to all, I have no idea where the drums are manufactured, other than it was a one shot contract, and no extra parts?.... But, the current delay in the revision program is probably due to my being AWOL the last two months!.... I have just this week, started right where I left off... only it will now be early Oct. before I can send any to Numrich... I have 40 in the revision stage right now, 35 for Numrich and 5 for customers..... It is a lot of work for anyone, and with my current status almost impossible.... but, in South Dakota, we had a saying when up to your windshield wipers in snow.. "If you're moving, you ain't stuck!" :).... and so it goes...... GT......:)

Every few years a batch of re-pro mags surface on the market. How does this batch compare in quality with that other batch that serial number digits when add up together end up with same number every time? Number was 16 or 17 or something like that.

G.T. Your our hero!!!!!

Well I should have one from Gunparts on Wednesday hopefully it has your "Circle GT mark" .....

Loooong time ago MGC made two versions, one that would accept 7 and one that would accept 32 rounds. Not certain if they made loader for 32 rounds version.

Cool! ...and remember you owe us a detailed range report on that bad boy. :)

Nice. So which one is pictured 7 or 32? How does it perform?

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3510

Well late this afternoon was a happy day a package from GPC arrived inside was another box.... it showed that is is one of GT's revisions :)

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3511

On the side was this label

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3512

And the mark that means everything.....

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3513

and the loader and instruction manual in English

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3515

Was feeling like a kid on Christmas day.... until I slipped it in.... it began to bind... I took out the grip screws and grips to see where the issue was.....

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3525

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3518

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3524

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3520

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3521

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3522

I have not had a chance to get my Micrometer out of the machine shop but it appears the nose on the mag portion of the drum is just a little larger than a standard Luger mag.... I see two options... lightly squeezing the nose to draw it in slightly (risk damage) or stoning and polishing the mag well in the Luger.... the gun has been refinished I consider it a shooter so I am not going to hurt value by polishing the that area to give additional clearance....

Over all I am satisfied with the product and GT's efforts in making this a usable magazine.... I am not faulting GT on this let me make that clear.... Hope over the weekend to have it up and running for a range report..... till then...... :cheers:

Went home and ruminated over this problem ...
now in the light of a new day I am going to use the Micrometer and
measure not only the nose of the snail drum but also the Luger...
I want to determine if it is possible squeezed in the area where the binding occurred....
if so I may apply a spot of heat locally to the area and tap it out with a brass punch....
I'll let you know which I find later.....

if so I may apply a spot of heat locally to the area and tap it out with a brass punch....Bad idea IMHO.

You might want to confir with GT. He may have a better or simple fix.

The area and fit you point out is one of the main problems with the repro drums.
There is a tolerance in the mag well, and the drums are at max or over.

Some drums just WILL not fit some lugers, solution is switch lugers, or reduce the size of the mag body on the drum.

Usually less than half a millimeter is all that is the problem, either use a hammer and tap the "big" spot in, or file it and sand it down a little. then polish and lube.

I have done this to both my repro mags to get an easy fit, and I still have a couple lugers that are so "minimum" that even a modified drum won't slide in easily.

Sounds like the cavernously oversized mag wells of the Houston stainless Lugers would be happy with the mags un-insertable in originals!

Drum beat! More info!
 

Hi Allen, glad to see you got one of the first revision drums from my shop... just a little back ground to help you "tune" your drum into obedience!.... When reforming the drums to fit, I only press die re-formed, (squeezed) the rear section of the mag tube to make it fit a couple of relatively tight Luger test frames... All that leave the shop fit those frames... on your particular unit, I would slightly squeeze the "wide" area of the feed lip area to make it fit... but, just enough.... Go slow, and work thru the sticking points.... one you have it fitting well, we can go further on the tuning... As Don will tell you, you CAN NOT over polish the inside of the drum mag tube and shell, the more you polish and the smoother it gets, all the better..:).... friction is our enemy??... It may not work right out of the box without some tuning.. but everything is there and it should stand up to any and all use and most abuse?... If you can work thru some of the small issues, it will come around... Also, I will repair or tune the drum for you at no charge, including postage until it works for you to your satisfaction... As long as it has that GT mark you're covered! BTW, use WW white box 115 target ammo for your initial testing?... Keep me in the loop ... and best of luck to all....til....lat'r.....GT.....:cheers:

They look like nice pictures. It's a shame that future members of this forum will never see them. :(

Thanks GT I will try your method later today and report back




Why wouldn't "future members" not see them?

Because they are hosted on an outside server!
Please go to the trouble to upload them to the forum - that way they will be here.

Links to outside server pictures or hosts disappear for different reasons, but with great regularity. And reading old posts and not so old posts with "picture not found" is not extremely helpful.

You went to a lot of trouble to do good pictures and a great write up- it would be a shame to lose its impact.:crying:

Here's an example -

http://forum.lugerforum.com/attachme...1&d=1460293049

Model Gun Corp of Japan made those back in the '60's, along with a number of almost exact copies of the Luger, Bergman, MP-40, etc. That drum fit their Luger and Bergman. :thumbup:

IIRC, the steel was a thinner gauge but pretty accurate otherwise. :)

I would guess that it would fit a 'real' Luger as well. My [early 60's] MGC MP-40 modelguns interchange magazines with a 'real' MP-40 and vice versa. ;).

Good point I've been doing it old school from the time that forums didn't provide photo hosting, I'll edit with photos hosted here... Though I have maintained my photos since around 2002 so there are some pretty oily threads out there with my photos .... But still a good idea to put them here I can free up space on my storage then

pinch point
 

BTW, in looking over the pictures again, the problem may be the mag release button?... Remove it from the frame, and see if the mag fits unimpeded.... It looks like that, more so than frame issues?..... Also, there is considerable variance in the P.08 mag catch parts as well.... just a thought....GT....:cheers:

GT,

That was one of the things I did remove the mag release.... Made no difference ended up doing a combination of things

1) miked Luger mag and snail drum nose to have a base line as to clearance
2) squeezed drum nose as suggested this also widened it slightly front to rear so it began binding in new areas
3) smoked mag to see where it was binding
4) stoned polished top area of mag well
5) sanded polished round part of the mag nose
6) sanded polished back corners of top of mag
7) noted some small bit of galling on roll crimp rib at top edge light filing/polishing also polished slot in mag well

What this accomplished was allowing mag to seat and lock up with mag release function tested with 4 dummy rounds worked fine, mag is tight but with firm grip pulls out don't need a mallet to remove it 🙂 ..... I may do a little more polishing after a little range time .... One area that had some high spots/dimples was in the relieved rounded inside part of the mag well these were caused when the front strap was stamped with unit markings these dimples actually had rubmarks from magazines.... So I took these down with a half round needle file will add some photo's when I get time at the computer

Here are the added photo's for this thread:

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3529

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3530

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3533

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3528

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3526

Success! :cheers:

Genius!!!

Fixed photo's they are now onsite rather than an independent photo host

There was one pleasant surprise..... it actually had the "B-slash-N" mark hiding under the lever..... which seems to be missing in all the photo's I have seen of this reproduction mag.

http://forum.lugerforum.com/picture....pictureid=3534



Also I have added photo's to the mag fitting that I described above......

Good work, now the fun starts!

Kabar2, nice work, photos and report! I hope the rest of us waiting for a GT revised drum don't have to go through that drama. But, if we do we will have your road map. :thumbup:

Thanks in past years on gun builders forums I have written on the builds as they progressed.... one build was a semi-auto 1919A6 and another was an AK47 45 caliber carbine using the mag feed way from a demilled Thompson trigger group and Thompson magazines.... so I guess I'm used to doing it with pictures and text in the photo's ..... hopefully those thinking of purchasing one of these drums isn't put off by my experience, remember GT stands behind his work and is there to help.... I was impressed with the drum, I have handled a couple of original drums and this reproduction feels good and solid... whoever made these tried to get it right & GT brought them the rest of the way.... the only thing he can't control is how each Luger to Magazine fits..... but even that can be fixed if your willing to try....

Latest in the drum progress!
 

Hi to all! Well, we've been pretty busy at the Tomek house over the last three months, with doctors, therapy, and hospitals, but I have found some time in the last few days to get back on task on the Numrich drums! As I mentioned before, I have 35 units for Numrich and 5 for customers that are currently undergoing revision and improvements.... I have decided that the very first task in the revision process, to be the most demanding one, and that is the relocation of the magazine catch notch.... It requires welding the notch closed, (.404" brass rod wedged in to retain internal radius, and as a heat soak) Then, I have to jig the drum up in a horizontal mill and cut the outside radius back to stock, then, I have to hand file and sand the radius to it's final dimension, then, I have to cut the top of the mag catch to the correct height, then, I have to plunge cut with a .250" to cut the curved part of the notch... then, I have to clean up the transition with a dremel tool.... I am at the plunge cut stage on all of them! but if you add up the opps at 6 X 40... I handle the drums 240 times! And, that isn't even the half of that parts revision.... Soooo, we're moving slow, but we're moving!....;) And we are also trying hard to make every effort to improve every part of these things..... The main reason for the order of revision, is I have to have enough units to afford to have the batch re-black oxide coated.... So sometimes it seems I can't get there from here, but every day is a new start and new challenge!
On the other side, my grand daughter has fully recovered, we are blessed and convinced prayers do work! Carols recovery is considerably more difficult, and we are concerned about long term, both as in regard to mobility, and of course, just dealing with a lifetime of pain..... But, we are alive, and still going! (looks like pretty tough to stop us!;)) Best to all, and my life long gratitude to the members!.....til....lat'r....GT

New, news! Drum project progress!!!
 

Hi to all, Well, finally got the mag catch notches cut and also the friction traps cut out of the shell interiors... and the current batch just went to the Black Oxide shop! When I dropped off my meager number of mag shells, I saw barrels and barrels of magazine shells from a major mag manufacture... The place I took my stuff to says he does over 2.2 million magazine shells a year for several major vendors?... While I was there I saw about 10 50 gal drums full of M1 carbine 30 round mag shells in the white... I told the owner I wished I owned his place and the mag manufactures place as well?..:jumper:... He said, carful for what you wish for.... :eek:... Anyway, with some recent trial and error efforts, I have been able to reduce the labor per mag from ludicrous to just ridiculous!!!! Polish internally seems to be the key... still... I am still trying different combinations of lube and any other idea I can think of to reduce friction... going to 400 W/D on this bunch, we shall see?.... Best to all, til.....lat'r....GT:thumbup:

GT, I need to send your snap caps back.

GT does stand behind his work, always has and always will :)

My magazine makes for a nice display ey?

Yes, Tink, that rig is drool worthy for sure! :thumbup:
Thanks for making us all terminally jealous. LOL :rolleyes:

Ed, Your photo reminded me of a 1930s Jimmy Cagney movie, where he was the bad guy with a full auto luger carbine with a drum. just another Hollywood error. I wonder how the new Trommel mags would function with 30 luger ammo? TH

I wonder how the new Trommell mags would function with 30 Luger ammo? TH Tom, I was asked that by George Fortier several years back so I loaded up a drum, stepped out to the pistol range beside my leather shop and let er rip. Worked just like 9MM.

Just a thought. In the line of a possible ban on magazines with a capacity of more than 20 rounds in the European Union: would it be possible to re-engineer a drum mag to a maximum of 20 rounds?

Gerben, I think it would be very simple. Open up the drum and weld in a stop at 20. Might hinder the wind up to lock in though..GT would know.

As Jerry said, a fairly "easy" mod; instead of a block, I would extend the arm to limit the space for the rounds. Add a curved section to the "pusher" area.

Then the Arm would lock into the original location of the button latch.

Number of rounds markings would be incorrect, though they could be "fixed" with some more effort.

correct! add a spacer
 

Don is correct, I believe all you would have to do is add a curved spacer that is welded to the internal swing arm of the correct dimensions to take up the 12 rounds not needed... One might need to also fashion a stop tab on the extended arm to combat over rotation of the spacer addition?... Basically an L shaped pad on the end.... :jumper::jumper:...GT

GT..better file a patent!

Drums to Numrich!...
 

Hello to all! I've really been busy with the drum revisions lately, and with the latest batches, I am confident that they will hold up, and feed as required.... I've found that there is no such thing as smooth enough.... and interior (bullet path only!) polishing is still the biggest and most important improvement challenge...
If you use WW white box 115 gr. the only malfunctions that still linger from time to time, is the occasional "smoke stack " or "stovepipe" stoppages on empty casings?... It is a combination of... weak extractors, and / or, slow bullet advancement in the drum... It can change from string to string on just ammo deviations... BUT, if your luger ain't perfect mechanically... it's probably going to jam occasionally... If you use the wrong ammo.. it will jam every time!!! :eek:... Sooooo, I have been sending them 6 drums a week/ 2 week period, and will do so for another 24 units.... I have revised 28 so far... They are listed in NUMRICH's as a G.T. Edition.... :jumper:... I will stand behind any drum with the GT on it! I really want these things to work for all of you! :thumbup:.... BTW, it is getting better as we go along.. I am always learning.. and there is always another way to "get it done!".... best to all, til.,..lat'r....GT :thumbup:

Drums out, feedback needed!!
 

Hi to all, well, I've been sending 6 GT marked drums and loaders a week back to NUMRICH for sale, but as of yet, had little interest, or feedback, or both?.... But, no problem, time will tell if we were successful or not on the revisions performed... I have found thru testing, that if there is a weak point on your Luger, the drum will bring it out fast! ....:eek:....Most definitely, if your Luger has a weak extractor spring, failure to eject, and smoke stack, stove pipe jams are going to be the norm... A rounded extractor nose will show the same problems??.. The drums I've sent out, are all now lubricated with red tacky grease... pretty much like all the originals I've cleaned and re-lubed... Dry lubes will probably work fine, and are a lot less mess, but the grease works and is easy to clean out and change if desired.. bottom line, lube of some type is required... One thing, if loaded with commercial ammo, the grease can, and probably will kill the primers?? It has on some of the live test rounds I used repeatedly... But, the most important BOTTOM LINE, is you're going to have jams!! Mostly failure to eject! BE CARFULL!!!! Safety first, STOP, WAIT,and then, clear the jam.. Its a thought process thing.. you learn it fast when things go wrong all of the time!!! I'm certainly not here to preach, as most of you have far more experience than I, but I would feel pretty sad if someone got hurt messing with items I've had a hand in repairing! Best to all, and let's hear about the success and or failure of our quest!... Best to all, til...lat'r....GT