Re: Mismatched magazines
 

I have to agree with you .

Its a shame that fine relics are so degraded in walue by set rules that fail to consider such fine restorations as have been accomplished by "Thor" and others and fails to receive its true walue at the market place. And thereby

deprive these true artists their due respect for returning these fine items to practically un detectable original condition .

Why in the world should a matching 1906 Eagle, if restored by "Thor" or other equally capable artizan, be relegated to shooter status .


ViggoG

Re: What is matching?
 

BCC,


I like your posting and agree with what you have to say. I buy a Luger because I WANT it! Yes, I prefer an all matching pistol including matching magazine, but only about 40% of my collection have matching and this includes the 1941 and 1942 plastic bottom rigs which may or MAY NOT be the magazines that came with the pistol. I have a very nice Luger which I purchased from a Vet that is "almost matching"; the pistol matches, including the magazine, except the entire toggle train is from another DWM pistol. How did this happen that the entire toggle train is different, I don't know and the Vet did not know. This is the way ot was when he traded for it from another soldier. I don't think the other soldier would have had the knowledge to make this change, so it was probably repaired at some German field armory; maybe??????


Anyway, the pistol is non matching and was priced as a normal mismatched pistol. I still consider this to be "collectible" and not in the shooter catagory, but priced in that range. I am sure that many parts were changed by Germans in the field to keep the pistols operational and this shold not effect the "collectability", just the price. I agree that the Wording being used by dealers like "almost all matching" is wrong, a mis-matched pistol is a mis-matched pistol and should be priced accordingly. What most purist Luger collectors want is exactly what came from the factory and the bewt condition possible. I do prefer all matching, but if I like the pistol I will buy it. Just because there may be a mis-matched part does not seem to relegate the pistol to shooter only. I feel most any Luger except the made-up parts pistols are collectible. I think the Russian imports are collectible; only their value is not what an original would be. The imports have allowed many people to become interested in Lugers because the are affordable. Many folks cannot afford to pay the $1000 and up for a collectible Luger and the imports have added many new Luger lovers who may be able to buy a more collectible Luger in the future. Also, the imports still have the same history, or maybe even a better history than the ones brought back from the Western Front. Sorry for the long post.


Marvin

Non-Matchinn Vet Bring backs...
 

I had a vet bring back once that was an S/42 1937 model. All parts matched except the Trigger and Sideplate which were matched to each other, and the rear toggle pin, which was a separate number. It came home with a chipped wooden mag bottom, which when when dropped for the last time, disassembled itself and was discarded. I bought him a functional mexican made replacement at a gun show when I found out he didn't have one.


I knew the vet personally and still do. He captured the luger in this condition from a young German officer in Belgium, doesn't own any other guns, and has Never been to a gunshop or a gunshow. It is one of those "top shelf of the closet wrapped in a soft rag" kind of mementos.


My best guess is a field repair by a German armorer... with parts from a couple of lugers that may have been battle damaged. Does this make that pistol any less authentic? I think not, does it make it valuable to a dyed-in-the-wool collector (I really don't care) If I can ever talk him out of it, It will remain with me until my time on earth is gone. I know this pistol saw combat, and is a relic of a period in the last century that outraged the world, and for which most of the current generation has no appreciation.


A sidebar: This vet told me that he threatened the German officer when he interrogated him, that if he didn't tell him what he wanted to know, he would shoot him with his own pistol... Although I believe he was bluffing, when confronted with the muzzle of his own gun, this soldier gave more than his serial number, name, rank, and date of birth.


I can tell you that I and sure that I NEVER want to experience seeing the muzzle of a gun so close that I can count the lands and grooves unless I am checking an empty bore for fouling!


-JS

Re: War trophy papers: A few more thoughts
 

Hannah, I have been with a collector at a gun show who was intently trying to talk someone down on a Luger (it was worth about half what the individual was asking). As soon as the guy behind the table pulled out the papers (not xerox copies) the man I was with pulled out his wallet. You are right, to some folks the papers add an air of 'combat authenticity' to the piece.

Re: War trophy papers: A few more thoughts
 

I have a Mauser HSc my father who was in the 101 Airborne brought home. When I was a kid I found a document on it-it was a form printed on a half sheet of paper signed by some duty officer stating he had examined "items of captured enemy equipment" which was this pistol and a pair of binoculars and passed them as legit souvenirs.

He had recorded the serial number on the magazine instead of the one on the pistol.

I personally would not give two cents for "capture papers" but that is my own opinion.

Anyone who has bothered to fill their military obligation will be familiar as to how arbitrary and haphazard these types of things things are in actual practice.


Mike P