interesting mini-luger .32 cal??

[skeeter4206]

I noticed it didnt have a side plate cover. Some of the parts just dint look to be fit with any quality at all. I still would rather have the real thing by all means. It just seems to me that guns made back at the early part of the 1900s seem to be just put together with a little bit of pride. I guess not having a T.V. or other things to divert ones full attention to their craft.

[tomaustin]

http://www.ai4fr.com/main/page_milit...uger_erma.html

[ithacaartist]

Originally Posted by tomaustin

http://www.ai4fr.com/main/page_milit...uger_erma.html

Tom's on the right track here...

The article describes the KGP69, which is cal.22., and slightly larger than the one you're talking about.
The one you provided pics of is the KGP68A (suffix A added to denote magazine safety added to comply with US import laws in 1968), made from about 1969 until, I think, the late 80's. Beeman imported the KGP69s towards the end, but it's the same gun with different, wood grips)
The KGP series Ermas are made mostly from steel, sporting a cast Zamak (fancy name for pot metal/cast zinc alloyed with aluminum, magnesium, etc.) frame. The Erma .22s most refer to because they are far more common, however, are the La, Ep, and Et .22s, which had a barrel liner and breechblock as the only major components rendered in steel. The bulk of the parts--frame, barrel extension, toggle train (exc. breechblock) are cast Zamak.
The KGPs function better than the cranky cast-parts models, despite attempted improvements made in the latter. The blowback system does not lock the bolt in battery as does a true toggle system found on the Parabellum--the axes of the toggle axles do not line up in the same way, and the barrel extension does not move during cycling, as this is not needed to unlock the toggle via frame ramps.
I have a .22,.32, and two .380s. The KGP.22 model is smaller than a P.08, and the KGP68s are smaller still, despite their larger caliber.
These are becoming pricey, yes, but some are asking ridiculous prices for them. Here is my list of what I think they should sell for:
La.22 poor $125-175 OK $175-275 great, maybe with stuff $250-325
Ep, Et.22 poor $125-175 OK $200-300 great, etc $275-350 Maybe tack on a few bucks for the charm of the long barrel...
KGP69 (.22) poor $200-250 OK $250-$325 great $350-$425
KGP68 (a) in .32 auto poor $175-225 OK $225-300 great $325-450
These sold originally for less than $200 (less than $100 for the Zamak models), so, some definite appreciation over time, as with all firearms. None, I think, are as numerous as original Lugers, so will remain relatively rare and prices will rise with market interest. There's one for over $600 for the .32 in great shape, with box and papers, etc. It's in almost new condition, but I feel this price is way out of line. These models are emerging from closets and safes, many in near mint condition, and present an opportunity, if bought right, to see a bit of investment growth. One thing for sure, nobody's going to make any more of them. Replacement parts are still sort of available (spring sets, aftermarket mags), but the commonly broken ones are scarce, like front sights for the Zamak models, and many other small parts. One could wait a long time for a specific part, depending on what it might be, if waiting for someone to part out a gun on G.B.
I bought mine as shooters, and they are fun. The KGPs are very cute, look closest to the real deal, and will be the most durable/dependable due to the extent of steel construction.

[el_loco]

Originally Posted by ithacaartist

....
The one you provided pics of is the KGP68A (suffix A added to denote magazine safety added to comply with US import laws in 1968)...

You have any information about that law?
Reasons, why they wanted a magazine safety?

Best regards
Klaus

[ithacaartist]

Klaus,

Sorry,although I probably should, I don't know much more about the regulations that went into effect in 1968. If someone doesn't chime in with a link to the law(s), I'll do some research and post later.

The magazine safety prevents the action from being fully opened unless there is a mag in place. Nor will it fire a round with an empty mag well. It's kind of a P.I.T.A. when working on the gun. It makes de-c0cking the pistol next to impossible without a convoluted, three-handed routine. I think it would behave as a pistol without a mag safety if the bar that travels the length of the grip frame, pushed up by the knobs of the mag, is simply removed.

I'll bet "cirelaw" would be able to give us a rundown on the 1968 stuff, if he sees this post!

D.P.